#116 Learn About Forward Deployed Naval Forces (FDNF)

What if you could spend seven straight years living abroad while serving your country? In this episode, we explore the incredible world of Forward Deployed Naval Forces (FDNF) through the eyes of someone who has made it their entire naval career.

Karl shares his remarkable experience of living and operating in Spain, Japan, and Italy—not as temporary deployments, but as permanent duty stations. From sailing in the Black Sea alongside Russian naval forces to conducting Taiwan Strait transits in the South China Sea, his story reveals what it means to be truly "in the fight" as a surface warfare officer.

What Makes FDNF Different from Traditional Navy Life

• How living in Rota, Spain creates an incredibly tight-knit community among naval officers
• The reality of four months deployed, four months off—with Europe as your liberty radius
• Why qualification timelines accelerate when you're constantly operational
• The support systems that make living abroad with the Navy surprisingly manageable
• How your social circle becomes your shipmates when you don't speak the local language

The Personal Side of Forward Deployment

Karl's candid discussion covers both the incredible opportunities and real sacrifices of FDNF life. He shares how he met his wife in Spain, convinced her to move to Japan, and now enjoys shore duty in Italy—all while maintaining strong family connections across time zones.

Why This Episode Matters

• Insight into career paths that can completely change your naval experience
• Understanding how different surface warfare can be from common perceptions
• Real examples of "seeing the world" beyond tourist experiences
• The leadership lessons learned from operating with international partners
• How to evaluate whether FDNF aligns with your personal and professional goals

The Vermeer Group is a residential real company matching military families with trusted real estate teams across the country.  If you have any real estate questions at all, please text Grant at (650) 282-1964 or email grant@thevermeergroup.com

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The mission of Academy Insider is to guide, serve, and support Midshipmen, future Midshipmen, and their families.

Grant Vermeer your host is the person who started it all. He is the founder of Academy Insider and the host of The Academy Insider podcast. He was a recruited athlete which brought him to Annapolis where he was a four year member of the varsity basketball team. He was a cyber operations major and commissioned into the Cryptologic Warfare Community. He was stationed at Fort Meade and supported the Subsurface Direct Support mission.

He separated from the Navy in 2023 and now owns The Vermeer Group, a residential real estate company that matches service academy families with trusted real estate teams all across the country. Text (650) 282-1964 with any real estate questions.

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Chapters

• 0:00 Setting The Stage: FDNF Focus
• 1:08 Carl’s Path From VJEP To Rota
• 5:10 Life And Community In Spain
• 10:43 Optempo, Qualifications, And Real Ops
• 17:10 COVID Shifts And NATO Engagement
• 20:54 Support Systems For Living Abroad
• 25:22 Why Jump To Japan Next
• 29:11 Carrier Ties, Port Calls, Family Balance
• 32:45 Real-World Navigation And FONOPS

Transcript

SPEAKER_02: 0:00

Hi team and welcome back for another round two with Carl here. You know, I hope you really enjoyed the discussion about the VJ program, the military graduate education program, and today's gonna be about his time as a forward-deployed naval forces sailor in Europe and Japan since graduating from the Naval Academy. He has spent literally seven straight years stationed abroad. Not just deployment, not living in Norfolk, not living in San Diego and deploying for six or seven months. He has taken PCS quarters to Road to Spain, to Japan, and now in Naples, Italy. And so if you want to learn about what the four-deployed naval forces are, what this life of a tool can be like, if you want to truly go and see the world, this is the episode for you. We're talking about the pros and cons of the experience, but highlight this incredible opportunity that exists for young junior officers to go see the world, to go, you know, actually be in the fight, deploy constantly, high operational tempo, and get to enjoy all of the experience and adventure of being a junior officer. Make sure to check it out. Let me know what you think. Thank you so much. I hope you enjoy the lesson. Hey Carl, welcome back to the Academy Incenter Podcast. Dude, thanks so much originally for what you did telling us all about the VJET program. I'm excited to get us back and talking about FDNF, the four deployed naval forces. And so if you don't mind, just giving us a quick rundown before we like jump into questions about what this is all about. Another quick rundown of what you did in your FDNF career so far. Like, where have you been stationed? What have you been doing? Like, what's your pathway been in the Navy?

SPEAKER_00: 1:34

Okay, yeah. I mean, hey, it's great to great to be back. Thanks again. So I after I finished the VJEP program, I went into my initial training for the surface warfare community. So I commissioned in May of 2018 and I actually didn't get to my first ship until April of 2019. So I did it, I did a couple of you know training schools. I I went to the surface rescue summer school in January of 2019, and then I went to the basic division officers course. And then I I got on a plane out of Norfolk and I landed in Rota, Spain. And you know, I had I had no idea what I was getting into, but I am so happy that I decided to you know pick that ship off the board on the uh you know ship ship assignment night. And um it was really cool because uh part of what shaped my experience was that by doing the VJP program and going through B Doc, I wasn't lined up with the same people that I had gone through at the Naval Academy because they had all they were already at their ships, they'd been through their training pipelines, they were there. So it was really cool because now I was making new friends and I was meeting new people who were coming from OCSN and N R O T C. So it was really cool to get into that that side of the Navy, start making new friends and everything. And when I got to Rhoda, you know, we we got a house pretty quickly, and I was living with with three other guys, and one was an OCS guy, and the other two guys were NROTC guys. So it was really cool to all be together with these different perspectives, and now the Navy is bringing us together, you know, abroad in another country. So back back back in 2019, during that time frame, we had four DDGs stationed out in Rhoda. Today we actually have five. And and the base has like the community has grown so much from when I was first there because looking back, you know, we we we've been in rota for a while, but we didn't actually get ships out there until 2014. And you know, now in 2025, we have a helicopter squadron out there, we have an MCM group, we have the you know, the Dezron and the and the task force, which is the the immediate superior in command of the ships out there. So there's actually a lot more opportunities for people to get out to rota, not just on an active on a on a sea tour where you're deployable, but you can also go to rota on a shore tour, which is really cool. And then, you know, for the other communities, there's also EOD Mobile Unit 8 out there, and they're superior in command as well, CTF 68. Yeah. So I was on, I was stationed on USS Porter, I was there for 30 months, and back the service community, they've they've a bit developing and changing things as we go on to help you know attract talent and keep people within the community. So now things are a little bit different for those first Divo tours. But when I was there, it was 30 months for your first tour, you get qualified, and then 18 months for your second tour. But now you have a menu of options. I mean, you can do a one-long 36-month tour, you can do a 24-month and 18, you can do 24, 24, and you could still do the 30 and 18. So they've allowed a little bit of tailoring so that people can have more agency over what kind of things they want to do. Sure. So I had a blast on my first Divel tour. And I think part of the reason why it was so awesome was because, and this is something that I had never thought of when I was picking an FDNF ship. When you go to a typical Conish ship, yep, they're they tend to be in larger cities and they're in the US, and and you know, people kind of have their lives on board the ship and then their lives off.

SPEAKER_02: 4:56

Yeah, you're you're living in San Diego, you're living in Norfolk, right? Like you have home and then you have work, right?

SPEAKER_00: 5:01

Like, yeah, exactly. And I mean, people can go home and you don't hear about them till you come back into work, right? And in FDNF Europe, what we call FDNFE, which is the ships out in Spain, the community was so tight-knit because it was only four DDGs. And you know, not everyone speaks the language. I was I'm very fortunate that I'm my background, I'm Puerto Rican. I grew up speaking Spanish. So Spain was not as hard of an adjustment for me as it was for some of my friends. And I think part of the reason why the roommates wanted me was so that I could, you know, do all the translating for them. Take them around. The community was just so cool. I mean, I tell you, when I first got there and the shit pulled in, I was, you know, the wardroom was really eager to receive us. And, you know, we they put you in the group chat. And I remember, you know, our first night that we moved into our house, we we just put out in the group chat, and we're like, hey, does anybody have a recommendation for you know a good restaurant to go out to dinner? And immediately someone was like, Oh, yeah, this place is good, but I'll join you. And then the other guy's like, Yeah, I'll come too. And before I knew it, it's a Tuesday night, and I'm going out to dinner with 10 people from my wardrobe. And I was like, damn, this is pretty cool. And uh, so I will say that the camaraderie and the tightness that you have with your ship, and I saw this as well in Japan. It's it's much closer in an O Kona ship than a Kona ship because it is a little bit harder to integrate into the community and to make friends, especially when you don't speak the language.

SPEAKER_02: 6:24

So you do have that isn't the built-in friend group, right? Like yeah, it's your friend group. It's a really interesting point that I hadn't thought about. Again, like when you're in San Diego, when you're in Norfolk, you're around so many people and people from other communities, and just civilians, people you know, maybe friends from back home, right? Like you're able to have a completely separate social life, right? Like if you're out in Spain and you don't really speak Spanish, you're probably not really making again, like your social community, your friend community out in town, right? Like it's it's staying with that that group of knuckleheads that are part of your your like destroyer squadron.

SPEAKER_00: 6:59

Yeah. And and it was that I thought that was really cool. And not only did we work together, you know, and not only did we do things out in town, but we also traveled together, which was which was awesome because you know, I had friends that were a little bit older, they were now on their second tours and they'd been to places and they'd say, Hey, you know, you're the new guy, come on in. I'm gonna take care of you, I'm gonna train you up, I'm gonna make sure you get qualified, but I'm also gonna show you what Europe has to offer. Like you mentioned it earlier, you know, when you go to FDNF, whether it's Europe, Japan, even R, your op tempo, or what we call your your operational time deployed, it's it's higher than if you were CONUS. But the trade-off you get is that hey, at the end of the day, you get to go home in a different country, and then now your your liberty radius is Europe. You know, it's Europe. Or in Japan, it's Japan. So I thought that was so awesome that you know, we we we tell you know our CO, we'd say, Hey, you know, we're leaving the 600-yard radius, but he was like, Okay, hey, as long as you're back by Monday, you can, you know, this is approved. And we we'd fly, you know, to Barcelona for a weekend or or you know, Munich for a weekend, or Paris, or something. And that was really cool. And I will say that, you know, when I first started off, another benefit to the FDNF world is that you get qualified a lot quicker in many cases than you would if you're COMIS.

SPEAKER_02: 8:27

Yes. So I wanna I wanna uh stop you just because like I want to dig in on this too, and and I appreciate it, and we're gonna lead back into that conversation. Again, when you use this term optempo, which I'm excited about talking about again, so many folks in the SWO community, and again, I wasn't a SWO, so I'm just speaking on the app here. I could be way wrong. But like again, I have a bunch of friends who they're in San Diego, they're in, you know, in Norfolk, whatever the case is, and their ships are in the yards, right? Or like they're in port, they're going through maintenance periods, they're going through maintenance phases, they're they're not out to see much, which again, for some people could be awesome. Like they they might really like that, but at the same time, it's then tough to qualify. Because if you're not standing watches like out to sea, if you're not standing OD, you know, like underway at night, like you're not getting the same experience that other people may be getting. And deployment time, like being out and actually operating in the deployment area can really adjust things. So I'm excited to turn this back to you and just talk about, again, your experience out to sea. How when when you say operational a lot, like how often are you out to see and how does that impact your qualification? And I know you were about to say that anyway, so I appreciate you letting me.

SPEAKER_00: 9:37

Yeah, it's okay. Hey, it's all good. I think there's uh there's two points related to to the to the operational tempo and your seed time. One is the the qualification piece of it, but the other part of it too, and this is what I think is the more interesting one, especially if you know, hey, we go to the naval academy because we're interested in serving our country and we want to be in the fight, you know. And when you're FDNF, you're up close and personal with our adversaries. So when I was deploying out in Rota, I was operating up close with the, you know, where the Russians operated, right? With the RFN. Before, I mean, I was operating in the Black Sea with with the DDG, you know, before the Black Sea. Yeah, that's that's got to be a bit sketchy. It's crazy, right? But you're doing the real world operations. And when I was out in Japan, you know, it was up close with the Plan, and we were operating in the South China Sea, the East China Sea, Taiwan Straits, Transits. I mean, this is where you're getting like you're getting your bank for your buck. This is where surface warfare is made, you know. So I'll I'll go back to the to the to the qualification piece. So I'll say when I when I got to Rhoda, our optempo was four months on deployment, four months off deployment. So it was a nice, consistent schedule. And to your point, I never went into the yards. So I I I I've been in Swanow for seven years. I still don't know what a yard period is like. And I have a lot of friends that have that experience, and it is a valuable thing to have, especially if you want to continue the service community. Sure. We did do maintenance pier side when we were on our on our off patrol, but when we were on patrol, you know, it was fully operational. So I, you know, I like that four months on, four months off. And you know, obviously I got to talk about COVID because prior to COVID, we were on our four-month deployment, we did like seven port calls. I mean, the longest underway time I had was like 10 days, and that was super cool. I was like, man, if this is what the Navy's about, sign me up for 20, you know. And then COVID came along, and obviously we couldn't stop in the ports, but we were still, you know, doing our best to stick to that four months on, four months off cycle. And when you we were focused and we were underway, it was it was really easy to get your qualification. And and and I tell you that, you know, I think the average qual time on my ship must have been about 15 months, which is definitely quicker than than a lot of the friends' CONUS. But I mean, I had I had friends that you know, they were motivated, they were really smart, they were getting their pins in in 11, 12 months. And and that's not bad when you consider it that, hey, I could check into a ship in San Diego or Norfolk, I could be in the yards for the first seven to eight months of my time. Then I have to go in through the normal, you know, readiness cycle where I'm going through my unit level certifications and doing all these things to then finally go on deployment and really out at sea is where you're gonna learn how to be a mariner. It's where you're gonna learn how to be an engineer, it's gonna be where you learn how to be a tactitioner. So that time at sea was really valuable. And for a lot of us, I would say that we were having such a good time in Spain that that COVID deployment was valuable because it allowed us to focus on qualifying and get our government slowly. Yeah, live in Spain. But you know, like everything, and I'll tell you now, working at Sixth Fleet, yeah, because we have the CTF 65 who owns the destroyers working below us. You know, obviously the world has changed since I was there between 2019 and 2021. You know, we have a conflict ongoing in between Russia and Ukraine, and we also have the conflict going in in the Levant, which thankfully has been calm as of late. But we have to remember that the the DDGs in Rhoda are there to provide ballistic missile defense. That's the primary mission. Um, so those ships are now operating more so in you know the eastern med and those areas, and they're not, you know, they're not getting as many port calls as they used to because back then we were doing a lot of engagement with our NATO allies. Not to say that we're still not engaging with them because our NATO allies are also deployed. We're just doing more things out at sea. But that's also great because it's an opportunity to be interoperable, it's an opportunity to build relationships with our allies, and that's valuable experience that you know any surface warfare officer is going to take with them for the rest of their career. But you know, that's just something that to consider. But I will say that the the experience of of living out in town in Spain is incredible. And one thing that I would I would you know advise everyone, whether they want to go to Spain, Japan, eventually Italy, because you can be in Italy for a short, or even Bahrain or you know, for that FDNF uh tour, is that uh it's a really great way to live abroad because you have the support of the base while you're there. So when you're getting your house out in town, you don't have to do that by yourself. You have a housing office that's gonna work with you to make sure that the house that you get has gone through inspection levels, that you get the support you need. So you don't need to worry about, you know, moving abroad, and then all of a sudden you're like, oh my god, I don't speak this language, I have no idea how anything works. There is a whole supporting system that's there to make that process smooth for you. So it's like, wow, I get to live overseas, but I also have this whole supporting cast that's making this experience easier than it would be if if you just did that on your own, you know, outside of the Navy.

SPEAKER_01: 14:58

Yeah, and no tienes in espanol. I mean, there's you can you can live, you can live like a normal guy out there, and it'll be it'll be just fine.

unknown: 15:05

Right.

SPEAKER_00: 15:12

It's it's great, man.

SPEAKER_02: 15:14

Yeah. No, I love it. I dude, I think that's so cool. And in honestly, now in just kind of a again, I think everything is great. Did you have that similar experience between Spain and Japan? Like, what was your difference between the two theaters of being FDNF? Like any comparison or contrast in those two experiences?

SPEAKER_00: 15:30

Yeah, I think I think that that's a really good question because my time in Rhoda is what inspired me to pursue my second tour in Japan. And it was a conversation I was having with with our roommates, you know. We were like, hey, let's see something different. And and I'm I honestly I I wanted to have that experience of like being a little uncomfortable. Like I wanted to go somewhere where I had no idea what the language is like. I mean, it's not even the same alphabet. And so that really like excited me. But I also knew that I was like, hey, you know, if if you know the PRC right now is our is our largest near-peer competitor, this is where we're we're prioritizing, you know, our efforts right now. I want to go operate there and I want to see what what it's like. So I'll tell you, I uh I went out, I went out to Japan. This time I was married though. So I actually met my wife in in Spain. She's she's not Spanish, she's from Argentina, but we met you know while I was stationed there, and and then we decided to get married. And that was that was a decision as a family as well, because I was like, hey, I have the opportunity to go to to go to Japan, but I know that you have you know your your life here in Rota. And and if I want I can pursue a fleet up and try to stay in Spain. And and my wife was like, no, but she's like, let's go to Japan. Let's let's you know, let's do this. And that was a new thing for her too, because her English wasn't you know as strong. So she really she really enjoyed the tour as well. And it was it was I'm surprised how much she enjoyed it because I was gone quite a bit. So I will say the the schedule in Japan is slightly different than the one in Rota. So Rota, we tried to do this four months on, four months off. In in Japan, it's a little bit different. If you're on a DDG on a destroyer, they try to do three months on, three months off. Okay, I was on a cruiser, and because I was on the cruiser, I was tied to the carrier, the aircraft carrier that's out in Yokusko. So the carrier goes out six months every year, but their schedule is a little bit different. So I had a little bit longer time out at sea, but I still spent, I will tell you, I averaged 50-50. Out of 18 months, I did nine months underway, nine months in port. Um but I but like I said, I wouldn't I wouldn't trade that. It was incredible. I mean, some of the port calls that we had out there, we were going to Korea, Vietnam, Manila, you know, Singapore, Guam, like really, really cool places. And my wife took the opportunity to jump on a plane and meet me in all those places and still travel around after I left. So she really liked that. And after I got back from my first deployment, we also did our honeymoon and went through a whole bunch of countries in Southeast Asia. So that's really cool because living in Japan, you have that access to go visit all those places. But again, you really you really lived the poster slogan.

SPEAKER_02: 18:11

Like you joined the Navy and you saw the world, dude. Absolutely. From living and working in Spain and traveling through Europe to living and working in Japan and traveling through Southeast Asia, right? Like you had an incredible opportunity to go see the world, right? And not only see the world in the tourist perspective, but like you're saying, operating in the Black Sea, right? Like being next to a significant RFN presence in significant like People's Liberation Army, like Navy presence in the South China Sea and around, like that's that's real life, dude. That's real life world experience. And that's crazy to your lore as a 70-year-old to your grandkids is gonna be not good.

SPEAKER_00: 18:50

Yeah. And and and when you talk about, you know, we talked about Veb where I studied political science and then security studies. When I was at the security studies program, I had a little bit of intentionality where I said, hey, I want to do my concentration in international security. I want to take a class on Russia, I want to take a class on on China, I want to take a class on North Korea, on Iran, on, you know, terrorist extremists. And it was really cool to see a lot of what I had studied. I mean, I took a class just on China and its military. And then seeing the militarization of what's happening in the South China Sea, these Spratly Islands and everything. And I had I had the coolest job that you can have as a SWO. I was the navigator over in Japan. So I had I got to see firsthand. I was like, hey, these are the areas that we can operate in, the ones that we can't. This is where we're deploying to. I was planning out Taiwan Straits transits. I was planning out freedom of navigation operations. I mean, this is real world operations that you get to do. And oftentimes when you're deploying from CONUS, yeah, you're gonna you're gonna deploy and you're eventually gonna get to those areas. But there is a lot of transit time. There is a lot of time where you're, you know, sticking around near CONUS and then you get out there and you operate. And it's true because, you know. I was I was out in Japan operating with with ships that were coming from San Diego. But I was doing it every day. You know, we got out of Tokyo Wan, we were out to sea, and boom, we were sailing towards the second island chain or the first island chain. So it was really cool. And then to draw the parallel between FDNF Europe when we were out in Spain, the same way that I was doing interoperability and doing a lot of exercises out at sea with NATO allies, while I was in Japan, we were doing a bunch of exercises with the Japanese Maritime Self-Defense Force, with the ROK Navy, we were doing stuff with Australia. So it was really cool because now we were saying, okay, these are our other allies, and this is how they're operating in the South China Sea. And this is also what we meet to them. So I think one of the biggest takeaways that I've had from both my experience when we went into the Black Sea and we did port calls along those Black Sea countries, you know, Bulgaria, Romania, Georgia, Ukraine. Yep. You really get to appreciate what you're doing because when you go there, the people are eager to receive you, they're they're eager to see you, and and they're grateful for the stuff that we're doing. So that was really eye-opening for me because I got to see a sense of appreciation, a sense of a camaraderie, and a shared understanding that we have that transcended, you know, any type of culture or language. So those were like two really, really cool takeaways from that time, just being operational out in Japan and being operational out in Rhode. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 21:23

And you seem to carry with you, again, just in hearing you talk, right? Carry with you a real appreciation for this whole experience, for being part of like the FDNF fleet, but also just for being a SWEW, like getting to be a service warfare officer. Has that been your experience? Again, again, I would say kind of common, you know, perspective, especially at the academy, is that like being a SWEW sucks, dude. Like people like slow eating very young. It's like a rough experience. You have a couple SWOs come back and they're like, I'm just so glad to be here at Annapolis because I'm tired of being gone all the time and like my life stinks. You know what I mean? And so I'd love to hear just your thoughts on the surface warfare community in general, and just a continued give you again a continued opportunity to say, like, why FDNF? Like, what are the pros and continued pros of being FDNF versus again? When you say, again, I just want to highlight when you say CONUS, the continental United States, right? Like you are stationed, your PCS, you're living in the continental United States versus being forward-deployed into a you know a foreign country.

SPEAKER_00: 23:50

Yeah, you know, I'm so glad you asked that because I, you know, I remember being at the Naval Academy and slow getting that bad rap. And, you know, I I I was lucky at the Naval Academy that when I did my midshipment cruise, I did a cruise out in in in the Middle East. So I got to fly into Bahrain, stay on a LSD for two weeks, and then fly out of Abu Dhabi. So I was kind of I was bit by the FDNF book, you know, very young in my academy, you know, time. But I remember, man, I I came back from my midshipment cruise and I was like, there's no way I'm gonna be a service warfare officer. You know, and it was, to be frankly honest, it was not my first choice, it was my second choice. But with all that being said, when you know, when I got assigned SWO, I said, hey, I'm gonna give it my best shot and let's see what happens. And when when ship selection came out and I had the ability to pick a ship in Spain, which I would have never imagined, I thought I was like, okay, I'll get my pick of the litter in San Diego. And and now we have five ships, so there's even more opportunities for you know for midshipmen. I said, Hey, you know what? I get to live in Spain, the Navy's giving me this opportunity, the academy's been a great experience, let's go make the most out of it. And and I'll tell you, I think it was a combination of I had really good leadership. So I had a great first CEO, I had a great department head, I had really good peers, so I had this tight-knit wardroom of guys who were all motivated, and they were just good dudes, you know. Outside of getting our work done, they were people that I wanted to surround myself with outside of work, you know, and and they took care of me. I was a young guy, I came in and they were like, hey, we're doing this trip. You should come with us, let's go out to dinner, you know, that kind of thing. And I think that's always nice when you go into an environment. And I and I think that's what attracts a lot of people to go into the Naval Academy, is that you you go into that place, and yeah, I mean, pleep summer, they're kind of doing that shock and awe. But then after please summer, you get invited into your company, right? And you're like, hey, you're now you're not part of the family. Yeah. So I think that was cool. And then you couple all that with the fact that I got to live abroad, I got to travel to a bunch of countries, and then I got to really hone my craft and trade. I think that made me garner a huge appreciation for SWO. So I I was coming out of my first tour, I was like, this is great. And and I get it, not everyone has the same experience. And I think a lot of it has to do with you coming in with that perspective and that attitude. And and you know, it's also understanding that hey, sometimes you might have a bad boss, but whether you're a SWO, a pilot, a submariner, that boss is not going to be there forever, you know, and then that person will rotate out, and the next person that comes in can be someone that that changes your perspective and that has a very positive impact on your life. And you know, from that point, I think the biggest thing I've taken away from my experience there, and then going into my second tour was that it's up to us, you know, and I tell this to all the midshipmen that are about to commission, is that we need to go in with a humble mentality and go in with the mentality that, hey, I want to be that guy that makes the difference. I want to be the reason why someone says, Hey, I want to stay in the Navy because you took care of me, you know, because it matters. That that boss that works directly above you that takes good care of you, that's gonna have a lasting impact. Yeah, yeah. And that's why I've had a positive slow experience because not everyone can say the same. Yeah. You ever coming home?

SPEAKER_02: 27:05

Uh you man, you manage to to uh to again double double C tour FDNF, and now you're you know, shore tour in Naples. You ever you ever coming back? What what's the what's the point?

SPEAKER_00: 27:17

Yeah, so I think it's a good it's a good segue from talking about my appreciation of the community, is that you know, I've really enjoyed my service, you know, to my country, and I want to continue to do it and give back. So I I have signed to be a department head. So that does mean that I do have to come back to the states. After after I finish up here in Naples, I'll uh I'll I'll have orders to New York, yeah, department head school. But you know, I I don't know where uh what ship I'm going to or what home port, but I do think it's time to do something in the US, just because I'm I'm all about trying to, you know, Swiss Army knife, right? That's what they say about Swes. They're a map, you know, jack of all trades, master of none. And yes, I have awesome experiences. I've been very operational, but I I I don't know what it's like to be in a fleet concentration area. I don't know what it's like to be in the yards, you know. Sure. I I don't know what it's like to be operating in a place where you have, you know, ships, aircraft, submarines, everything from across all communities with a bunch of you know stars that are commands that are working right by you. So I think it'll it'll be nice to at least do one tour, get that perspective. But I'll tell you, the opportunity I get to go back, I'm I'm taking it because it's so much, it's so much fun. And and and I'll I'll talk about it. Let's go. I I I love it. I you know, man, being in Japan was so cool, going out and and eating ramen and and sushi and and and just being able to see such a beautiful culture traveling all over the country. I mean, it was just such a cool experience. And then when we were out in Japan and the shore duty options were coming up, I told my wife, I was like, hey, you know, we could we could go back to Europe and we can go to Naples, Italy. And she said, she said, no, it's not we can, we are. That's what I want to do. So I had I had six billets open in Naples and I just ranked them one through six. And yeah, and I was fortunate enough to get one of them, and and now we've been out here for a year and a half, and the amount of travel that we've been able to do is just absolutely incredible. One of the cool things about shore duty is you know, we get a lot of long weekends for the holidays, and they'll tack on an extra day, so they turn into four-day weekends. And like I said, my Liberty Radius is Europe. So, you know, in a few weeks we're we're going over to Munich for Oktoberfest. You know, we've we've been all over some of the islands in Greece, we've traveled all over Italy, we've gone back to Spain a few times because my wife still has friends there. You know, it's it's been a really, really awesome experience. And it's been a time now where I've disconnected from the SWO community, you know, I haven't been on this deployment opt tempo. And now I'm working in an operational fleet with people across all communities in the Navy. So I'm I'm honing in some new perspectives, I'm sharpening that tool of becoming a war fighter. And now I have that perspective and I understand why we get assigned certain operations or things that we did on deployment, and who are the people that are planning those things out and pushing them down. So it's it's been an incredible experience, you know. I can't complain.

SPEAKER_02: 30:24

Yeah, dude. Oh man, this is this is good stuff. But again, I just want to, this is a really cool opportunity to talk to the families of midshipmen and potential, you know, even midshipmen who may be listening, that like Yeah, absolutely. Even even within your community, your experiences can be wildly different based on what you choose, right? Like as a cryptologic officer, my experience was very different than a lot of other people who were cryptologic officers, right? I was constantly deployed, constantly in support. I was a I was a rider, I was a you know, direct support for submarines working with like CTF69 over there in Naples. And like I rode, I rode boats all the time. And then I had counterparts who were cryptologic guys who were just sitting on a watch floor at the NSA for their entire five years, right? And so like that experience can be very different. You could be a swell who's in the shipyards in Norfolk for the whole time, and maybe you ride a deployment or your boat finally gets ready to go and you deploy a little bit, or you can be FDNF and living abroad and traveling and seeing all this different stuff. And look, people live different lives, they have different experiences. You know, prior to going to Spain, you were single. Some people are getting married, some people have different stuff that like being close to family is helpful. But all of these opportunities exist and you can kind of pick your adventure if you do the research and talk to people and have mentors and find out what opportunities exist. Because if I'm recapping the conversation we just had, you went to Spain, you lived in Spain, you had a great time in Spain, you deployed a bunch, you sailed in the Black Sea, you sailed in the East Med, you were all around Europe doing stuff that was important, you interacted with civilian populaces across the world who found appreciation for what you were doing in the Navy. You found a beautiful wife who you're married to and who you love to. You went to Japan, you traveled all around Southeastern Asia, you had a great time, you continued to sail and do missions that mattered to national security and the security of our allied partners around the world. You had a ton of fun out there. Now you're back in Naples on a shore tour, hanging out with your wife who loves the journey, gets to be with you. You're traveling all around Europe, and you've done that within seven years after graduation.

unknown: 32:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 32:21

It's crazy. I I this is something that I would have never imagined. And to going back to that, it all started thanks to the decision to go to the Naval Academy. Yep. So you know, I I wouldn't change anything. It's been absolutely grace, and I'm blessed, you know.

SPEAKER_02: 32:34

It's so sick. And again, it it speaks to the power of FDNF, right? Of being like forward deployed. And again, it's a trade-off because at the end of the day, you haven't been home. And if you're someone who like is super attached to your home unit or you have a reason to be attached here, yeah, it may not be the right fit. But for the right person, what an incredible opportunity to get out there and be a part of the forward deployed naval forces in Europe or Japan or anything of the sort, right? And so it's super cool. We're gonna get ready to like just conclude here and wrap up a little bit, but I want to turn it back to you again. First of all, thank you so much for the time you've had sharing this experience. But if there's anything you felt like we didn't touch on or that you wanted to touch on about your FDNF experience, I'd love to turn it back right to you now to give you an opportunity. Floor is yours.

SPEAKER_00: 33:23

No, yeah. Thanks again, Grant. And and I think, you know, I do want to touch on that last point where you talked about that one of the biggest trade-offs as FDNF is the fact that you are far from home. You know, I I was someone that grew up very tight-knit with my family. And, you know, it's tough when you're deployed, when you're underway, but it's even tougher when now you're not just deployed, but you're across time zones, you know. But my family has always encouraged it. And I think the best part is is they they've now also gotten to see cool places because everywhere I've been, they've taken the opportunity to visit me, you know, either once or twice. So they've liked that too. And and you know, now that I have a second family with my wife's family, yeah, they now ask us, hey, when are you gonna go to Japan again so we can go visit, you know? So absolutely. I think you know, in summing it all up, I'll tell midshipmen, don't sleep on the surface warfare community. I mean, it's a great, it's a great community. It's the one that offers you, in my opinion, the most flexibility because you really do have a laundry list of options for where you can be stationed, you know, on ships. And then when you go to shore duty, I mean the possibilities are endless. You're not some of the other communities have a little bit of tighter things that you need to do when you're a young divo. But you know, my mentors have always told me that this tour that you do after your divo tours, and if you decide to stay in before your department head tours, it's kind of your freebie. You can you can go and you have the liberty to do whatever you like. And and you know, there are opportunities to get master's degrees, whether that's VJEP or maybe on your own time, so that you can free up that short duty so you can do something fun and exciting. And and I I just think that that's really, really cool and one of the advantages of being SWO. Heck yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 35:02

Heck yeah. Well, Carl, thank you so much for taking the time to join us today. I mean, we're on a massive time difference here, so thanks for staying up late into your evening in order to get this recorded. I appreciate you. Like, thanks for reaching out, thanks for being a part of this, thanks for sharing your experiences and stories. And you know, I'm looking forward to it. And for any midshipmen who are out there who may listen to this or families of midshipmen who incur, like want their midshipmen, you know, to get in touch with a person like Carl, learn more about FDNF, just shoot me a message. Shoot me a message. My sole goal is to be an ultimate connector in this community. And if you have follow-up questions, I know we can create, you know, a level of community to get those things answered for you. So I appreciate everyone for listening. I hope you have a good rest of your day, and thank you so much. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of the Academy Insider Podcast. I really hope you liked it, enjoyed it, and learned something during this time. If you did, please feel free to like and subscribe or leave a comment about the episode. We really appreciate it to hear your feedback about everything and continue to make Academy Insider an amazing service that guides, serves, and supports midshipmen, future midshipmen, and their families. Thank you.