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The Academy Insider Podcast - Your Guide to The Naval Academy Experience
The mission of Academy Insider is to guide, serve, and support Midshipmen, future Midshipmen, and their families. Through the perspective of a community of former graduates and Naval Academy insiders, this podcast will help you learn about life at the United States Naval Academy in Annapolis. Through our shared experiences, Academy Insider guides families through the anxiety and frustration caused by lack of understanding, misinformation, and confusion. This platform is designed to better relationships between midshipmen and their loved ones. This podcast is not affiliated with the United States Naval Academy, the United States Navy or Department of Defense. The thoughts and opinions are exclusively those of your host and his guests.
The Academy Insider Podcast - Your Guide to The Naval Academy Experience
#061 The Classroom Experience at the Naval Academy: Insight into USNA Academics
What is class actually like at the Academy? How do midshipmen take notes? What resources are there for midshipmen who may be struggling with academics?
In this episode I sit down with Sarah Riley, who shares her unique path from the courts to the classroom. Sarah, former submarine Junior Officer of the year onboard USS John Warner, talks about her transition back to the Academy as a faculty member. The episode is peppered with humorous anecdotes, including pranks on her former professors, and she stresses the critical role of experienced instructors in mentoring midshipmen.
Ever wondered what a day at the Naval Academy looks like? Join us as we walk through the disciplined structure of a typical day, starting with the 0755 first period start time. Learn about the precision of 50-minute classes, the importance of the 10-minute breaks, and how lab-based courses are accommodated. Sarah gives us a glimpse into the traditions that set the tone for learning, the evolving methods of attendance, and the importance of engagement. Discover the unique blend of old traditions and modern tools that keep midshipmen focused and accountable.
Balancing academics with athletic commitments is no easy feat, especially at the Division I level. Sarah discusses the strategies that help midshipmen navigate this challenging landscape, from proactive academic support like extra instruction and group study programs to the Writing Center's invaluable resources. Hear about the importance of communication, planning, and a supportive environment in juggling these dual roles. Sarah's insights provide a comprehensive look at how the Naval Academy fosters success, both on the field and in the classroom, ensuring that midshipmen are prepared for the rigorous demands of military and academic life.
The mission of Academy Insider is to guide, serve, and support Midshipmen, future Midshipmen, and their families.
Grant Vermeer your host is the person who started it all. He is the founder of Academy Insider and the host of The Academy Insider podcast and the USNA Property Network Podcast. He was a recruited athlete which brought him to Annapolis where he was a four year member of the varsity basketball team. He was a cyber operations major and commissioned into the Cryptologic Warfare Community. He was stationed at Fort Meade and supported the Subsurface Direct Support mission.
He separated from the Navy in 2023 and now owns The Vermeer Group, a boutique residential real estate company that specializes in serving the United States Naval Academy community PCSing to California & Texas.
We are here to be your guide through the USNA experience.
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If you are interested in sponsoring the podcast, have an idea, question or topic you would like to see covered, reach out: podcast@academyinsider.com.
Welcome to Season 2 of the Academy Insider Podcast. Academy Insider is a 501c3 nonprofit organization that serves midshipmen, future midshipmen and their families. At its core, this podcast is designed to bring together a community of Naval Academy graduates and those affiliated with the United States Naval Academy in order to tell stories and provide a little bit of insight into what life at the Naval Academy is really like. I hope you enjoy it. Thank you so much for listening and reach out if you ever have any questions. Hey everyone, and welcome back to the Academy Insider Podcast. In today's episode I'm joined by Sarah Riley, which is super fun to me because we both wore the number 22 while we were playing for Navy basketball at the same time in Annapolis, so that was a super fun connection to have. She's a great friend of mine and now she's back at the Academy as an instructor, and so in this episode we do a deep dive into the classroom experience at the Naval Academy. If you're interested in getting to learn a little bit about what it's like at class and how teachers are trained, how teachers prepare and kind of all about the instruction as well as the classroom experience in Annapolis, then check out this video. I'm super excited. We go in depth about a lot of different topics and the reality is things have changed since I've been there in the classroom experience. So it's great to have her insight, her perspective, in a direct information source for you to learn about the full classroom experience at the Naval Academy. So I hope you enjoy the episode. If you have any questions, let me know. Otherwise, take a listen. I hope you enjoy it. Thank you so much.
Speaker 1:The Academy Insider Podcast is sponsored by the Vermeer Group, a residential real estate company that serves the United States Naval Academy community and other select clientele in both California and Texas. If I can ever answer a real estate related question for you or connect you with a trusted Academy affiliated agent in the market which you're in, please reach out to me directly at grant at the premier groupcom. You can also reach out to me on my LinkedIn page, grand premier, and I'd be happy to respond to you there. Thank you so much, and now let's get back to the episode. All right, hey everyone, and welcome back to the Academy Insider Podcast. Today I'm joined by a very special guest the double deuces in the house, the Navy basketball 22 pairing, sarah Riley. Thank you so much, sarah, for coming on and providing a little insight to the Academy Insider audience on all things Naval Academy and, if you don't mind, just giving a quick background about again who you are, where you're from, how you ended up at the Academy and now what your current role is back at the academy.
Speaker 2:My name is Sarah Riley. I was born and raised I'm the fifth of six children out of Cincinnati, ohio. I ended up at the Naval Academy because I was recruited to play basketball, which was an opportunity that I had no idea the doors it would open and the growth it would provide, and I graduated in 2018 with an undergrad in ocean engineering, went on and I did the Bowman Scholar program. So I was lucky enough. I went straight out to Monterey, california, got my master's degree in mechanical engineering in 2019, did the nuclear training pipeline and then got my first duty station, the USS John Warner Virginia class fast attack submarine out of Norfolk, virginia, did a pretty cool UCOM deployment on her while Russia invaded Ukraine back in 2022. And now I'm back in the department that raised me, teaching alongside what were my professors now my colleagues back in the Naval Architecture Ocean Engineering Department in Rickover Hall, which has been awesome.
Speaker 1:How's that feel to now come back? Do you still feel weird and like want to call them sir and ma'am and they're all like, hey, no, sarah, it's fine, we're colleagues now. How's that transition experience been?
Speaker 2:There was definitely a threshold of understanding, I would say when at first I'd like call them Professor Blank or, and then they stopped responding to me when I would call them professor, because my two research advisors actually from my undergrad, professor Mooring and Professor Schultz, now Mike and Sarah, you know I've been learning my ways. They are still there at the academy, so that's been super fun, and then I also have kind of trolled them a little bit, so I still have my midshipman blues, so my you know everyday midshipman uniform, as every good mid should still have six years later. And so on Halloween and on April Fool's I decided to just wear that as the uniform of the day, and the first time I did that they did not know it was coming, and so I walked into their office and asked for EI and they started to offer it to me before they looked up and realized who it was and who was asking.
Speaker 1:They saw the black pants, black shoes and they were like, oh, here comes another midshipman. Yeah Well, that's so funny, so cool and just for a little background context as well, for the Academy Insider audience, I also deployed on the John Warner. I didn't do deployment with Sarah, but I was lucky enough to actually come back and be the evaluator for the Cryptologic Direct Support together on a submarine, on the Mighty John Warner, and so our lives just consistently find ways to overlap, which has been truly incredible. And I think what's really fun about this whole thing is, as we'll get into it, a big piece of what I talk about a lot is the fact that there are so many incredible mentors all across campus, even if they're not in the role of a company officer or the role of a commandant staff, they may just be instructors, but they come back with real fleet experience and they come back and they have the ability to do more than just instruct in kind of an academic sense, even though that is their primary responsibility. But it's so incredible primary responsibility, but it's so incredible and right.
Speaker 1:These are, as you watch this episode today with Sarah, just know like she is one of the people, and there are so many like her who are instructing as well in the classroom experience to your son or daughters or for the prospective students out there. Like this is someone who would be teaching you and I think that's a really cool experience as well. And so, as we make this transition, this will be a focus on the classroom experience about all things in the Naval Academy and a college level. I'm sure is a very difficult transition. So what for you, was the process of transitioning into becoming an instructor?
Speaker 2:So as soon as I had the orders in hand, the mindset starts to shift right. So internally I feel like I did some preparation as far as reaching out to the department figuring out what class they thought I was going to teach. They were able to give me some materials while I was still on my boat and so on duty days I would be in, my sailors would be solving random engineering problems, because we were looking for things to do. You know, we're nerds on a submarine, so I had them solving Archimedes principle and doing a bunch of different math to see if they could get it right. So that was kind of a fun way to tie in my boat with where I was going. So some prep there. And then I was fortunate I transferred in around that August timeframe and they have a. I don't know how many years they've been doing it, but they have a new faculty orientation and so for two days you have just an auditorium and people cycle in and out explaining the Naval Academy classroom experience and every new faculty member gets it, both those in uniform and the, the civilians, and that was an awesome way for me to not only set my mindset but also hear the concerns that the civilians had and be able to explain it from a grad that had been to the fleet and come back of, hey, yes, that should be a concern, or that may not need to be as big of a concern or a focus as you need, but tone in on these skills, but then they were able to provide feedback about what they were thinking about. So that was a really cool couple of days.
Speaker 2:And then I had about two and a half weeks to prep my first course that I was going to teach, en 400, which is Principles of Ship Performance, and it's a mainly naval architectural class. And it's a mainly naval architectural class. It is a first-year level or senior level class. That is the pinnacle or the final core class that you take as a non-engineer. So if you're not an engineer, you still get a bachelor of science degree at the Naval Academy. If you get an English degree, you get a bachelor of science in English right.
Speaker 2:Our English majors take Calc 3. Our English majors take Calc 3. Our English majors take Thermodynamics, and so sometimes when, by the time they get to EN 400, or what's informally known as boats, they are a little bit scared of Rick over Paul. So it's a really cool. I love the course because I'm able to really tie in my Navy experience. So I had enough time to look at the curriculum and stay far enough ahead of the mids and tie in my sea stories to really drive stuff home. So I was kind of prepped for my first semester and ever since I've been teaching new stuff every semester. So it's really a learning environment both from the teaching side and the student side.
Speaker 1:That's so cool and you had mentioned in there that you were mixed between both civilian and military faculty and there are a lot of people who are helping you in this new and new faculty orientation, new teacher orientation. Do you mind giving the audience a little bit of a breakdown, roughly, about the, the separation or the difference in numbers between military faculty, civilian faculty and then with those is, how many people are like you that are rotating every couple years and how many are tenured staff that are like they've been at the academy for a long time and they plan on staying for a long time?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so it kind of breaks down, like Grant was saying, into two big categories. So we have our civilians. That are about half of our faculty as far as the academic side goes, in Luce Hall. It's kind of confusing. So Luce Hall is where we do all of our navigation and leadership classes, so that is majority manned by military and there's a lot of rotational officers in there. But in the true academic, under the provost side of academics, about half the faculty and staff is civilian and it's awesome. The exception to the rule is not having a PhD, so pretty much everyone's a doctor on the civilian side and more qualified than the next. And also really they have the buy-in to the academy. There are unique opportunities and things that they sacrifice by teaching at the Naval Academy. So our civilian staff is awesome. It's been awesome. It's really cool to be back here too, to be back teaching with civilians and get the perspective of civilian engineers, my department particularly. It's part of the reason I came back. The civilians were still here, that were here when I was in it and I remembered them and I stayed in touch with them and I'm back and I'm excited I'm back From the military side.
Speaker 2:It breaks up into really two big categories. So there's the permanent military professor or permanent military instructor, and they get long-term orders and then you're either a permanent military professor if you're a 05 or above, or a permanent military instructor, or if you're an 04. So it kind of depends on your seniority. And typically the permanent military professors they have PhDs, right, they do a PhD and then they come and they're a permanent military professor. It's just kind of based on a timing of the progression of their career, where the permanent military instructors also, they usually have a master's degree and then they're back but they also have long-term orders. So they're, you know, most of them get here about their 12 year mark and they're 04s and so they can retire out of that job. So they'll be here for eight years and they provide a lot of continuity. They've gone out, they've done their thing and they've really delved into academics, but they can kind of help bridge the gap.
Speaker 2:And then there's us, right, the rotational instructors, so the lieutenants, typically sometimes the 04s, the backbones of the department, right, the ones that bring the energy from the fleet, some creative, new ideas. I would say that we are in touch with the fleet where we can drive the like innovation of what they'll see out there and how do we relate that to these higher level academics? So in a typical department, I would say there's, depending on how many lieutenants there are. There may be like three or four lieutenants that are rotational. There's usually a few pmi's, a few pmps, and then that will make up some military's about half of it, and the civilians are about half yeah, no, absolutely so.
Speaker 1:Thank, thank you for that rundown. And again, it's one of these really interesting things that are so unique and so cool about the academy experience and I I think having I think you're saying that that that rotation, the rotational instructors that come in every couple years and bring that fleet experience and bring that fleet perspective, that make the naval academy classroom experience more than just the academic side, is really cool. But for you again, as someone who's coming in with zero teaching experience whatsoever, standing in front of a 400-level class, like as class for first-class senior midshipmen in their four-year university, was it nerve-wracking on day one? I want to start transitioning this conversation now into actually being in the classroom at the Naval Academy. And for you, on day one, how are we? How are we feeling? Are we nervous? How large is the section that you're teaching? How long are the classes Like? What are you preparing for on day one and what was your mindset going into into the first day of teaching?
Speaker 2:I would tell you. I walked in on the first day and I just really couldn't believe that I was going to be in front of the group. I didn't teach till fifth and sixth also the first day of class, my first semester so I had to just sit there. So I guess we can talk a little bit about the school day. I don't know if you've covered it before, but school day starts at 7.55, the first period.
Speaker 2:It is intentionally at 7.55 because colors goes on base at 0800. And so we get everybody into the classroom so they don't get caught outside by colors and then have a delay to start a class. So class starts at 7.55. A typical class is 50 minutes long. So you're going to have 7.55 to 8.45. Then you have a 10-minute period to change courses and then you're going to have 8.55 to 9.45. Change courses and then you're going to have 8.55 to 9.45. There's four in the morning that go like that and we have a big lunch period about from noon to 13.30 or 1.30 in the afternoon and then we have two periods after lunch, so 13.30 to 14.20 and then 14.30 to 15.20. So the end of the day. Typically for most majors there's kind of exceptions to the rules in there, but the bulk of the brigade. That's how it runs Most classes.
Speaker 2:If you have a lab, that will be two of those periods. So it would be an hour and 50 minutes. If not, you'll have a one class period class, depending on the type of classes. I've taught both. Some of our classes will run it's like a typical college. Some of our classes will run Monday, wednesday, friday and it'll be one period.
Speaker 2:If you have a lab involved, maybe it's a four credit class like that EN 400 boats class I was talking about we have a lab. So we have right now I'm teaching on Monday we have one period. On Tuesdays we have a double period lab. On Wednesdays we have one period and then on Friday we have one period. So we don't have anything on Thursday but we do have that lab period. So we have five hours of instruction total for the week. So yeah, I didn't teach till that fifth and sixth period on the first day. So I just got to sit at my desk and hear everybody else about what they think the pulse of the brigade is and how they think this academic year is going, and everyone's passing me oh, how was your first class? And I'm like still waiting so I finally get in there?
Speaker 2:yeah, it hasn't happened. So I finally get in there and I once again. It was just a surreal moment. I have like the most beautiful corner classroom on the side of Rickover, like beautiful view of the Severn. I'm like looking around, like mids are starting to come in and then I realized that the instructors that I got the most out of at the Naval Academy were just really present and were there and were themselves and they were competent and they were excited that I was in class and that went a long way. So I just kind of took a deep breath.
Speaker 2:They kick off class at the beginning of class at the Naval Academy by calling attention on deck. So for those of you out there that have no idea what that means, if you ever find yourself in a class at the Naval Academy and you don't know what's coming, you're going to be very confused. But essentially, at the start of every class, someone calls attention on deck to get the class oriented, ready to start class, and everyone stands up, stands at attention, until the instructor, whether civilian or military it happens in both sides until they say carry on or take. It happens in both sides until they say you know, carry on or take your seats. Whatever it may be, it really gets the class ready to go, ready to learn. Get back in your seats, ready to start class.
Speaker 2:That also happens at the end of class. It's the same type of thing. It's how we start and end classes at the Naval Academy, which is a very unique nugget. So they call attention on deck. I'm like, okay, take your seats. You know, and you know, we just got into it and once again, I just kind of go back to that.
Speaker 1:Do you make, do you make your students make like an actual verbal accountability report? Also, at the start, do you just have, like the section leader, hand you like attendance at the end, after they call attention on deck. What's your style on that one?
Speaker 2:I actually have a Google drive, right. So I have a section leader. The section leader is in charge of accountability and they're the ones that call attention on deck and I have a Google sheet that I only share with the section leader and they mark whether they're absent or present and then I just do a head count to make sure that, okay, if they said that two people were absent and I had 22 and I only had 19 in class, then like who do we miss, type of thing, I don't have issues. I don't have issues with that typically, but I just do the headcount to make sure that I know how many people may need to make something up or do I know where they're at.
Speaker 2:You know there's a lot of accountability that goes on my part too. I care about these mids and I care about their well being and if something came up, sometimes it requires that circle back. So, yeah, accountability is huge I mean everyone has to take compared to what a lot of my. You know I said I was one of six kids my siblings they weren't, so usually they're, they're in class and or have some type of excusal and I drive a lot of proactiveness with the you know if you're going to miss class, let me know, let's, let's get ahead of it. We can talk more about that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, absolutely. And I, I, I just realized like how old I am Cause. Yeah, of course, having a shared Google sheet makes, or Google drive makes total sense. When we were back there 10 years ago we were handed I like the section leader was like literally doing it in pencil, I was like man there's some times where I don't feel too old and then I like realized that and I was like, oh yeah, no, I yeah, that was 10 years ago. It's a, it's a little bit of time now.
Speaker 2:It's definitely different. You know Google Classroom. I didn't know what that was. That's been a learning curve Phenomenal product, really like it, but I was like learning it along the way. So there's definitely some things that feel the exact same thing, but some things that, in execution, feel a little bit different.
Speaker 1:Sure, absolutely, and teaching fifth and sixth period can sometimes be a little bit different, because fifth period they have the lunch beforehand, so there's a long period of them to to show up on class on time. But I always remember hating classes in rickover no shade to rickover, my my guy. Because, like a lot of times, I was in eighth wing, and so for anyone who's not super familiar with the naval academy campus is that rickover is on the complete, like as far away as you could possibly be from my room where I lived, and so, like going from swim class to like an engineering class in Rickover or something, there were times where I was a little tardy, I would show up late to class. So in your case, how have you dealt with midshipmen who arrive a little bit after the prescribed starting of the class period?
Speaker 2:So, once again, I like to treat the mids like they're JOs junior officers. My strategy, or my take on it, is if it's egregiously late and they show up with lines on their face and they were probably asleep somewhere, whether it's incidentally or on purpose, that's a conversation to be had and probably something that goes in the attendance report. You know you roll in if it's somebody that comes in and they're, either they have, you know, their sweat's dripping down their face or their hair is wet from the swim pool, or we have the conversation. So I always open up on that first day of class of let's be adults about this. Right, there are going to be things that come up. If you know it's going to come up every week, let's talk about it and see if there's any ways we can optimize that time switch for you. Sometimes, if it's Lujun pool all the way to Rickover, like I don't care how fast you're going, you're probably not going to be there in that 10 minute swing, but making sure, okay, what does that mean for you? Don't be disruptive when you come in. Right, if I know you're coming in a little bit late, like, get in, sit down. Don't disrupt what's already going on. I understand that.
Speaker 2:I also am a big proponent of hey, if you're stuck in medical and you're going to be 10 minutes late, shoot me the email while you're in medical, right, then I know it's timed. I know that that's where you were. I hear you, I see you. I'm not looking for you at the start of class. I see the email, I know you're coming late. All good, we're being adults about it. For firsties, they have a lot of watches that they stand that might pull them out of class. So they have a lot of things they're juggling, they have squads, that things come up all the time and I don't need to be all up in their business. But I do want them to know that they need to communicate if they're not going to be at the place that they're supposed to be on time. So I would say in general, that has really carried for me and I've never had issues with it Because they we talk about it like adults and also usually resolves itself in a way that they're on time.
Speaker 1:No, 100%, and I love that and that was a big thing. That was something I always respected with a lot of professors and I think that's the general consensus across the board and it's just a good life lesson again getting ready to go into the fleet which is, yeah, it's proactive communication right. When there's not proactive communication, that's when things start to get fishy. Right, because again, you have responsibilities, you have things you care about the midshipmen and where they're at and what's going on and everything of the sort. But if you just communicate early and often right and just be like, hey, here's the situation. Like you're saying, if there's something that's going to be repeatable or recurring, well, like let's, let's figure out a solution early on. Or just be like, hey, I understand where you're coming, just do your best to not make a scene when you come in, right, or you know whatever the case is but that was my experience as well, going through it or whatever the case is but that was my experience as well, going through it, especially as an athlete, which is, if you just communicated what was going on and what the situation is, there are reasonable adults that we're just gonna come up with the best solution, right, and it's not a big deal and so that's always. My thing is, sometimes when Chipmen get in this world where they're like too worried or like nervous to have this conversation about like being late or about doing these things, so they just don't have it, and then that just makes it 10 times worse. Right, instead of just being super proactive about the communication and that's going to solve 99% of of issues. Amazing, all right.
Speaker 1:Well, let's, let's jump in. This is going to be a fun one, especially, especially cause I've been I've been plenty sleepy in a classroom before. I've been plenty sleepy on a submarine before. I've been plenty sleepy in a classroom before. I've been plenty sleepy on a submarine before. I've been plenty sleepy in all these situations, and I think a massive reality of the Naval Academy experience is that you are perpetually exhausted. Again, when I talk about this and we talk about the classes, you heard Sarah say I like to joke and I can say it because I'm not officially part of the Academy.
Speaker 1:The Academy academic schedule is very much like a high school on steroids. This isn't a normal college where you have maybe two periods a day and you're taking 12 or 13 credit hours. A lot of these midshipmen are taking 20 to 23 credit hours in a semester, right, and you have class, quite literally, maybe five or six of those periods a day, so you're doing six to seven hours of academic instruction. You then have military training, military obligations, and, for a lot of midshipmen as well, then you have to go compete. You have to go compete at a division, one level, and try and be again and try and win straight up Again.
Speaker 1:The coaches at the Naval Academy, they're not military staff, they are college coaches and their job is to win right, and so there are so many factors that go into a midshipman's time that it makes it really difficult and midshipmen are exhausted a lot, and so that was a long intro and lead into the fact that sometimes midshipmen fall asleep in class and sometimes it's hard.
Speaker 1:As much as that was a long intro and lead into the fact that sometimes midshipmen fall asleep in class and sometimes it's hard. As much as you'll want to be paying attention, there are a lot of midshipmen fighting for their life, doing the head nod, kind of the bounce here, thinking they got it but they don't, and so I just want to turn it over to you now and be like now on this side of the fence because, as a midshipman, I'm sure you've been sleeping in class Now as an instructor. Now on this side of the fence because, as a midshipman, I'm sure you've been sleepy in class Now as an instructor. How have you handled again handled midshipmen who have been sleepy in class. What's your communication and conversation to midshipmen who may be struggling and how have you navigated that as an instructor?
Speaker 2:Yeah, sleepy mids are a thing, right, sleepy mids have always been a thing. Sleepy mids will continue to be a thing and will probably always be a thing. Some strategies that I use is I tend to be a pretty energetic person. I like to bring a lot of energy to the classroom, so try and keep them engaged, whether it's they're writing notes or asking questions or we break it up with a big J-O topic. Right, hey, pause, pause, cool, we just talked about this really in-depth thing. Let's talk about the time that I X, y, z or I give them three options. Let's talk about this, this or this. You guys take a vote.
Speaker 2:So try to bring the energy is kind of my initial shield that I use to try and combat it as I can. The reality is that that shield sometimes works and sometimes it's just going to be one of those weeks that I'm going to have a lot of sleepy mids. So a short term solution that I use is the candy warhead. I usually have at least a couple of warheads in my pocket. I also use this on my boat, right? So people are tired on watch, or if they were the watch, you know, the eight hour watch felt like it was about 15 hours. You know, if you throw a warhead at somebody, that at least for five minutes is going to like burn a hole in their tongue or something and wake them up. So sometimes I'll do a warhead. If I see two students sleeping, I'll do like a warhead challenge and they have to like see who won't make a face and that breaks up class. So try and break it up a little bit. If I see not engaging with the material, I know that they're not receptive to it and the cost is not only going to be for them but it's going to be for me too, right? So I really really try very hard to optimize what I teach in the classroom to be relevant to what they're they need to know and to get it to translate to them the best that I can. So I'm trying to use those 50 minutes to the best of my ability so that later, when they have 500 other things they might have, they still have to do homework. They still have to do the practice problems. They still have to do things, but they're not learning things right. They shouldn't necessarily be learning. They might be memorizing, they might be reinforcing, they may be practicing, but I don't want them to feel like they're teaching themselves. They're really trying to keep them awake as part of that battle.
Speaker 2:Some people will stand up on their own. Sometimes I'll ask somebody to stand up If I really think that people are dragging. Sometimes we'll take a pause. Hey, I think that we should probably just if you're nodding off right now, take a walk up and down the hallway, go touch the window on the other side of the hallway and come back. Right, let's take those two minutes, because if I take those two minutes and I get their blood pressure at least a little bit higher, oftentimes we can kind of close out class or chunk it and be adaptable, right? Hey, we're having a slow day today. I think that if I let you guys go right now, we can use these 10 minutes more effectively at the start of class tomorrow. Use this to reset.
Speaker 2:Sometimes you have to really have an awareness I will say that like a awareness of the really sleepy mids. So there's a threshold of, like, most mids are going to nod off in some class at some point throughout the day. Right, not every mid is going to be awake. You know, there's some days you're awake all six periods. There's some days that in the middle of third period. It's just not your time. You know it's not out of bad intention, but if I'm noticing a trend, typically I will then kind of pull a thread right as part of a leadership question hey, what's your, what's your sleep health? How are we prioritizing stuff? What's your time management? Look like I've just noticed you've been nodding off.
Speaker 2:Mdc, the Michigan Development Center, has the ability to do sleep help. So if they're not prioritizing and as they become more senior, oftentimes the first thing that goes is their sleep. So they start juggling. As you grow in your academy time you start juggling more and more balls and so the more balls you're're juggling, typically the sleep ball is the one that you know get gets the weekend push through. You know you got to get through the academic stuff like that. So pulling a thread on that to see if we can just identify some stuff to get them the sleep that they need, or probe on how much sleep they're getting, to see if it is a diet related, is it a crash from an energy drink? What's causing? If I really see that there's a trend and then effective if it's affecting their academics right, there's some students that they might not off here and there, but they can still retain and get the information they need and they perform. There's other students that that's just really not the case.
Speaker 1:No, absolutely. Energy drinks are a real thing thing in the military. I never, I never got it. I I was luckily able to stay away from that whole trend, but the whole military, the whole energy drink thing is for real. Are you, are you an energy drink type person, or are you? What's your situation?
Speaker 2:I my jo tour. I did. Or my caffeine was my achilles heel. As soon as I became aopss unqualified and was trying to get qualified submarines and get us, you know, help the team get certified for deployment, caffeine was just my friend. We were the compadres together getting through the good fight. But I have now weaned off of it and you know I drink the normal like cup of coffee in the morning, but nothing, nothing excessive anymore. I've luckily been able to come down off of the Celsius days, but there was a time, time and a place and sometimes you just got to do what you need to do to literally complete the mission. So it wasn't the best time. It didn't make me feel amazing, but it kept me awake in a way I guess was better than some other choices.
Speaker 1:Sure, sure, yeah, we'll save the tobacco talk for another time. That's certainly a thing too. But yeah, anyway, back to the classroom. Right Back to the classroom. Kind of just some administrative questions now, if someone's listening here, just kind of a little rapid fire of the structure of the midshipman classroom. In today's day and age, how are midshipmen taking notes? I remember again we were issued a laptop, but still for a lot of times I was kind of a handwritten note person. Have we shifted to some of the laptop or like an iPad slash tablet? What's allowed in the classrooms and what do you see commonly from midshipmen as it relates to note taking in the classroom?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's definitely changed. So the the iPad kids are real. I kind of dog on them a little bit sometimes, but in year two I become more and more of an iPad kid myself, so I can't dog on them as much, but yeah, so I would say our classroom is evolving. It is, you know, a traditional classroom sense where we have desks, chairs, projector, you know chalkboards, projector, chalkboards. The chalkboards are still around, which is pretty cool. I love the chalkboards, love a good chalk talk. So traditional in that sense it's fun.
Speaker 2:But yeah, a lot of iPads, a lot for note-taking. I found that I think that it was COVID really that made this environment that people were had. All the instructors had to post everything digitally to give students access to it, and so because of that, a lot of them got ipads and they can just do it all digital. In google classroom you could submit it digital. Right, I can do a lab all digital and it saves a lot of paper. There's a lot less paper. I can grade their digital um, like it's their handwriting, but I can grade all the digital submissions. So, yeah, still issued laptops. Everyone's issued a laptop. I would say they're not issued iPads by any mean, but a lot of midshipmen do opt to an iPad type of setting and you know pen and paper, so it kind of depends.
Speaker 2:I would say I always have like a course policy that says you know you can use all these things and I think it's phenomenal and I think that there's a lot of great things. But it's also very easy for me to tell when you're doing something that doesn't have to do with class. It's just not hard for me to notice when you are, you know, typing on your iPad or you are furiously like really getting after an email and I'm I have a PowerPoint up and there wouldn't be any reason for you to really be typing. I don't know if I find somebody like type notes out to a PowerPoint. So I always have the clause that says, hey, I'll make you go stone and chisel if you refuse to pay attention with what you're doing.
Speaker 2:I want you to use what's good for you but also understand it is a distraction at times. Our Center for Teaching and Learning is also a phenomenal resource that has some really cool stuff that I've been experimenting with a little bit to kind of jump into the new teaching age. So they have loaned out to me for this semester some clickers and it's just an extension that can go on to PowerPoint and I can live, pull my students off these clickers. Whether it be a multiple choice question, free answer. It's like a little BlackBerry Looks like a BlackBerry back in the day. It's like a little Blackberry looks like a.
Speaker 2:Blackberry back in the day, and so that's a pretty cool way to like engage with students, do technology or even just like. Hey, I put a poll of like how are you guys feeling today? Right, like I'm feeling ready to learn. I am just here because I have to be here. I'm actually like pretty tired or like indifferent. Right Like I'm here and I don't feel anything. So it's cool. You can do a lot of live feedback and that's been a really cool thing from the Center of Teaching Learning that I've been kind of expanding in my classrooms and getting ready to experiment with this semester here.
Speaker 1:No.
Speaker 1:I love that Way, way cool. I mean so many things that are just enhancing the midshipman classroom experience, which is incredible. I like it. And as as times change and things adapt, like again, we just have to continue to involve and improve. Right, it's just that simple, and so that's a really a really interesting kind of insight into the perspective. And then kind of the last admin question as someone with a tiny bladder and who is constantly hydrating for sports game, for sports practice, et cetera, to get ready to play basketball what's the midshipman policy as it relates to going to use the restroom during class? Is that something? Is there a blanket policy across kind of departments? Is it up to the uh, instructors choice kind of? Are you just like, hey again, kind of like being adult about it, just go and come back, or is this something that you kind of like someone has to request permission to kind of exit the classroom? How have you handled that in your classroom?
Speaker 2:Once again, this is one of those kind of first day talks of hey, if you need to use the restroom, go use the restroom and come back. Don't use the restroom, don't start class, leave your backpack down there, come back 10 minutes into class and not use your time, right, you know? So I don't ask them to tell me they need to use the restroom, whatnot? Sometimes I'll have times where I'm like, hey, this is one of those. Like, if you need to use the restroom in the next three minutes, you should go, because, like, we're going to do an example problem and then by the time you would come back. If you do it five minutes from now, you're not going to get it and it's going to require extra instruction later. So I try and provide them those cushions, if I know that it's something that I really don't want them to step out for. But at the end of the day, I would say I don't think that anyone restricts a midshipman's ability to step out to use the restroom.
Speaker 1:Sweet. I love it and I'm glad we asked that, because you used a term that you've used previously in the episode. But it's kind of going to be the follow-on and kind of the finish out of this episode and that's this idea of extra instruction. And so what I want to focus this conversation on and we'll get into specifically what extra instruction is but basically extra instruction will come from a midshipman who may be struggling or lacking the understanding or not understanding again a certain aspect of the instruction that is happening. And so I'll start with kind of a higher idea, which is what are you seeing as an instructor now, as midshipmen are coming through your classroom, what are you seeing that is causing some midshipmen to excel and others to struggle? And then, with that is with struggling midshipmen, this is kind of we get into the EI section how have you helped address that and what resources are available to midshipmen who may be having a harder time than others in the classroom?
Speaker 2:So you know there's going to be classes, that you may be a great student and it may just not be your thing, right?
Speaker 2:So I think that the biggest thing I see with students that struggle is that they are very reactive instead of proactive in the classroom.
Speaker 2:So they know that they don't understand the concept, but instead of getting help before an exam that's going to be 20% of the course grade or a lab that's a big, a big lab report they get the bad grade and then they start talking about it. So I think that that's really what drives the biggest struggle. If you know that that's where you're at and you come before that exam, you get that you ask for, you go to the writing center, which is a beautiful resource before you submit that paper. Yeah, so the biggest reason that mids I see struggle are that they're being reactive when something happens instead of being proactive. So they have the big exam and they get the bad grade and then they come talk about it. Or they have a big lab report. They don't go get help before, they don't ask questions, they submit it, they get the bad grade and then they come talk about it when the students that may not be understanding as much in the classroom or before, but they see more success is typically they proactively.
Speaker 2:Hey, I need that extra instruction. So EI or extra instruction, is just time coordinated with your instructor or your professor, whoever's teaching the class, or maybe somebody else who's teaching the class in another section. Right, we offer that too. Hey, I don't feel like I understood the way this person explained it. Sometimes people will come to me and say, hey, I'd love to have a JO explain it to me. I'm like student being engaged in the material, asking the questions. Live, right, you get out of a lecture and you do not know the answer to a question or you are confused by something. You just hang back for a minute or two and ask that question to the instructor, right there, right then, and there it's hard to do but pays off a lot. So extra instruction we have tons of programs at the Naval Academy to help students in the classroom. So not only extra instruction with professors and instructors around the yard. We have MGSP Midshipman Group Study Program, which is for the midshipmen, by the midshipmen, and there are people who have already taken the course, and then a couple nights a week, depending on the period of the course or, you know, the bigger courses might have a couple different ones. These midshipmen are in certain classrooms and then mids who are in those classes can go ask another midshipman who's already taken the course questions, which is awesome, peer-to-peer leadership thing.
Speaker 2:And I would say a unique thing about the Naval Academy that we have that live and that's constantly happening for a bunch of our classes. We also have the Academic Center for Excellence and that is funded through a Naval Academy class and it provides a lot of nighttime help and the writing center. So the writing center is a typical writing center, just like any other institution has. But I would say that they go the extra mile because they understand how MIDS work and how efficient we need to be in that writing process. That is definitely a unique aspect of the Naval academy that we get a paper and we get it assigned and you think it's two weeks away. But that two weeks of time, in reality of midshipmen, the amount of time that is occupied in that two weeks is way more than a lot of other institutions. So although it may be two weeks out, you you know that window that you have to actually truly hone in and work on that assignment is different. So our writing center is phenomenal, really great. We have librarians that are assigned to each department, help with honing students in on good research products, or you know different sites they can use to use verified information, finding the right book. You know, and they're there with the mids at 10pm in the library ready to help. So really surrounded by a support system that is an endless bounty of people ready to support the midshipmen. And I think that's something that has been unique for me.
Speaker 2:Being back the second time is back in 2014,.
Speaker 2:You know every midshipman before I did.
Speaker 2:One of the first things you have to memorize is the mission of the Naval Academy and you memorize it, you know it, you're ready to go, and when I came back here the second time, it was very interesting to think back that the mission isn't just of the midshipman, it's the mission of the whole Naval Academy and it's what we're all surrounded by. It's to develop midshipmen morally, mentally and physically, and I've just done a lot of reflecting on that. That you don't appreciate it as a mid. You memorize this thing, you know that's your mission as an individual, it's an admission of the entire institution and so the impact of that is just so great and implication and it's why everyone shows up right. It's why grandma's still working in the mid store, it's why Janice is still a mail woodworker. Right, there are people around the yard that are still there since that or there when I was a mid, because they believe in developing the midshipmen morally, mentally and physically, and all of that support system in the academic realm is geared right towards that.
Speaker 1:I'm so glad you said that because I love every bit of that. That's been my big whole thing with Academy Insider what separates, again, a service academy from another type of education in a really positive way? And it comes down to the mission of the place, right. And like you're saying, yes, it's a personal mission to develop yourself in those ways. But, exactly like you're saying, you're surrounding yourself, when you're putting yourself in a location where every single person who is there is truly invested in the benefit, in the development, in the support of the midshipmen who are going through the experience, right, and so it's a really cool thing.
Speaker 1:And even for me, some anecdotes that you're talking about of like MGSP and EI, when I was a firstie, second semester, first year, I had pretty good grades. I think I graduated with like a cumulative I'm not off to a good start here and I can't even say that word but somewhere in like the three, four range. So I got like good grades. I wasn't a 4-0 type person but I got good grades. And second semester, first a year, I wanted youngsters on fridays. So this term youngster for everyone here like, yes, a youngster is also a, a third class midshipman, but when we're talking about the academic world. A youngster is meaning you have zero afternoon classes on fridays. So when you're a firstie you're able to start Liberty after your last military obligation. And so if you don't have class in the afternoon, your last military obligation is that new meal formation, so you can eat lunch and go Right. And so I was like all right, I want no classes on Friday. I played four years of college basketball. The last. The only thing I want is to like have long weekends. I was like I just want to get out of here, right.
Speaker 1:And so, as a result, the only elective I could take as a cyber operations major was this 400 level computer science class, called it was. It was all about parallel computing and it was like way, way above my level of computer science knowledge because the computer, the cyber operations major for everyone who's listening, it's a really multidisciplinary, it's an incredible major, but it's kind of a jack of all trades major. You take multiple classes in electrical engineering, mechanical engineering, computer science, information technology, all of the different things, even some law and like psychology classes as it relates to social engineering, like a really cool interdisciplinary major. But I was in no means like a really good program.
Speaker 1:And so here I am in like a 400 level computer science course, so lost, just like so lost. And I did it because I just wanted a youngster on Friday and so going into as you're talking about like being reactive instead of proactive my proactivity that early part of the spring was getting out on Fridays. I was like, yeah, I made this choice for a reason, like I'm taking my liberty and so I'm. I'm like at the 12 week, 12 week mark with a D, with a D, and I'm like, oh snap, like if I failed this course I might be a late grad.
Speaker 2:I was like I can't.
Speaker 1:I can't do that. I was like I'm raising these, my tires. I have a D in this class and I go to Carl. I go to my guy, carl Albee he's a computer science professor over there and I was like I need your help. I was like I need I will do whatever, like I need your help and for literally like the last six weeks of the semester, I came in for extra instruction multiple times a week. When you talk about professors who truly care and are truly invested in your success. He made a point, even outside of his already established office hours, to meet with me individually multiple times, multiple hours a week, to make sure I got to where I was, to get ready to take the final exam. And I just remember, because I was stressing out, I took that final exam. I was nervous, cause I still like I don't really get this stuff. He sends me an email. He's like you got a 79, congrats, that's a pass for the class. I was like let's go. I was so juiced. I was like I'm graduating.
Speaker 2:Come on.
Speaker 1:Hitting the little, hitting the little thing.
Speaker 1:But, it's just, it's an anecdote right To truly but again to flip this and make this a little bit more serious is you have to be proactive about it, though. You have to pour into the experience. There are a lot of instructors who obviously will try and be as proactive as they can, but in order to maximize your experience as a midshipman, you need to pour into it, you need to ask for help, you need to be proactive to get these things, because the resources are there. The resources are there to help you through that experience. You just need to take advantage of it. Right, you need to take advantage of it.
Speaker 2:There's a small aspect.
Speaker 1:Yep.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's a small aspect too that is a fine line of I want to help you, but I also want you to learn how to ask for help, Because that's a huge part of being a junior officer is acknowledging that you need the help and having the willpower to coordinate and find the help, whether that goes to classroom, mental health, physical health, all the aspects of the Naval Academy. That's also a really important skill. So there is a fine line that's kind of walked of. Like you acknowledge it, you might probe it a little. Hey, would you want to stop by my office to talk about this more? But you can't walk too far, can't force them into the meeting, right? There is an aspect that's special about the Naval Academy of hey, no, you need to own that too, which is huge. And also, grant, by the way, you are now part of the engineering school of the Naval Academy. Did you hear about the reorganization?
Speaker 1:Oh, am I a Group 1 major.
Speaker 2:Now you are.
Speaker 1:That actually Group 1 does not exist, so Group 1 isn't really a term we use anymore.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so this past summer I'm the so back story. I was the public affairs officer as a midshipman so I ran the Instagram Facebook. When I was a firstie I invented Firstie Friday, which is my claim to fame Because now every service academy does it. I should have like copyrighted it because I could have gotten like I don't know something. Now everyone does it and it's just my tradition that lives on.
Speaker 2:But so I came back to the Naval Academy. They found they knew that was true. Right, my professors, who are now my colleagues, shout out and they're like you're going to be the public affairs officer for engineering and weapons. And I was like, ok, sounds great, I'll do the award ceremony, take pictures, help with the Instagrams, whatever it be. And then this past summer they decided it has been decided that computer science and cyber are now part of engineering and weapons and we have renamed the school to engineering, computing and weapons. So all of the courses that are in Hopper Hall and all the courses or all the majors that are in Hopper Hall and all the majors that are in Rickover Hall are all under the ECW Engineering, computing and Weapons School.
Speaker 1:Very cool, and so give me a full rundown then. So we're not utilizing like group one, group two, group three, or we just we're just calling them by their real names now.
Speaker 2:By their schools. Yeah, so we have the School of Communities and Social Sciences, so HMSS, we have the School of Math and Science, and then we have the School of Engineering, computing and Weapons.
Speaker 1:So yeah, we don't really.
Speaker 2:You know we don't want to, because you know we need amazing political science majors and it's not a tier type of thing, right, we need people from all these different aspects to apply expertise to the fleet. I promise you that I don't write as good of a paper as my friend, you know, sarita Joe Condi, who was an English major right, she could write way better papers than I could, but teammate right. But I could solve thermodynamics better than she could, right. So, whatever it may be, you got to balance it out, and that makes us a stronger fleet. That's why we offer all of the majors at the Naval Academy but they're all technically based back to that, we all get a bachelor of science, no matter your major.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, phenomenal, I hadn't ever even thought of it, as what's funny is to me, it's such just like a objective term. I hadn't even thought about it as like a tiered one, two, three, but I get it, like I get it, and so, wow, all right, there we go, learning more about the schools and majors. So that's exciting and thank you for that insight. Yeah, and that is exciting. Now we're, now we're really homies Engineering computing and weapons.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there it is. Yeah, we got a new logo going, you know.
Speaker 1:All right, I love it All right.
Speaker 1:Well, a couple final questions, and this one, relevant to us, especially as varsity athletes, that both you and I were, and especially basketball we were talking about this even before we started recording which is that basketball's tough because in season we play Wednesday, saturday, and so if you ever had a road game, you would usually leave Tuesday, like after lunch to get to where you're going and then stay the night and then prepare to play a game on Wednesday evening, and so you'd miss all of Wednesday class, tuesday afternoon class, and then, in a lot of cases, if you had a Saturday road game, you would go.
Speaker 1:You would get back on, like you know, thursday morning at 3 am, go to class Thursday, but then it'd be the same thing on Friday you're out in the afternoon to go travel to your next game, and so you can end up missing a lot of class as a result of varsity athletic travel or just any kind of ECA travel. So the question back to you is for those varsity athletes or for those midshipmen who are on movement order how do you handle midshipmen who are not going to be present in class, especially because we've spent a whole ton of time talking this episode about. You know the importance of being in class and the academy putting high accountability on midshipmen being physically in class.
Speaker 2:So midshipmen being in class is a very, very high priority, but the reality is that, no different than in the fleet, you got a lot of things you got to prioritize and sometimes we do compete at the division one athletic level and we got to travel for those games. Right, turns out, holy Cross is not very close to Annapolis, maryland. So the reality of that is that people are going to miss, get in this class for sporting events, and so what I do is I have a student intake form beginning of the semester to kind of get a demographic, figure out who is in season, maybe big leadership roles they have with their clubs Right, because I could also provide them or afford them to be away during the school day. Right, if they have big movement orders, they're dealing with different things Right, and then have the conversation on that first day, like right, my first day is very much like let's be adults about this. And if you're going to miss class, right, if the assignments due that day you're going to miss, it's still due. Right, you don't get an extension because you're going to miss class. It might seem silly but it's really to keep you on time Because otherwise everything just starts getting behind and you're going to have more competitions and you need to keep yourself on that schedule. So you know, if you wait till last minute only takes a minute type of thing.
Speaker 2:Midshipmen, a lot of midshipmen, have a lot of that, you know. Get it, get it in at the last minute because I can, and that last minute's gonna be when it's my last minute. So driving that home of that accountability, or hey, I understand, that's my, that's my like upfront. But if there's an extenuating surface dance we have two away games this week then let's sit down and make a plan before that even happens and remove that stress from yourself. And once again, I really try to drive them to be the problem solver. Right, don't just give me the problem. Come to me with an initial solution that you have to the problem right, like, what do you think is a good idea, what is reasonable, what is fair, what is going to, you know, not give you an advantage or a disadvantage to your classmates, but also take into consideration that you're going to be sleeping on the bus on the way back from Bucknell, that you're going to be doing this extra thing, right? So having that conversation to really drive that and then drive that email or that correspondence that happens ahead of time instead of reactive. They're going to miss the lab. Okay, we're going to miss the Thursday lab. We also do this lab for other sections on Tuesday. Can we get you in that lab? It's a better experience for you. You're going to get more information because it's trying to get you to understand more things about this class.
Speaker 2:So doing that, and then I really like to, you know, take that list of their ECAs or their sporting events and if I know that they're competing, be like oh, how was that game last night? Right, did you guys win? Usually I look up the score if they won and then I ask about it or I'll be like, hey, it was a tough one last night. Like you, all right, are you ready for practice today? Are you drinking water? You know, like you can kind of have that banter back and forth, because then they get to buy in.
Speaker 2:They are student athletes. We have have 1,400 student athletes in the Naval Academy. Right, we have over 30 Division I, varsity sports. The reality is it's a huge part of our population and they have the least amount of time on their hands and they're trying to balance a lot of really big things. So driving that and but also kind of you gotta let them learn too, right? You gotta let them learn that sometimes they are going to have the perfect solution and we're going to it's going to be this beautiful thing. Other times they're going to miss the class, we're going to do poorly on the quiz and we're going to have to do that reactive process instead. But really having a more of a sensitivity to the people that are missing class, do that stuff to grab it early and try and drive that conversation if they don't feel comfortable initiating themselves.
Speaker 1:I love it. I love it and agree wholeheartedly. Well, this is perfect. I just want to say thank you so much for taking the time to come on and talk about the classroom experience here at the Academy. As we start to wrap it up, I do just want to give you just one opportunity Again. A big piece of what I'm trying to do with Academy Insider here now as well, is really again just highlight all the amazing aspects and benefits of the Naval Academy experience for prospective high school students. So I want to turn it to you to allow you to give your best recruiting pitch of why a young man or a young woman should consider, you know, applying and pursuing an education at a service academy, and specifically the United States Naval.
Speaker 2:Academy, world-class education. It's top of the line. We're on the front edge of research for our nation. We are fully accredited. We have a bunch of different majors, one of the top engineering schools in the country, if not the world. I mean, there are professors at the Naval Academy that have written the textbooks that govern the laws and different equations or the policies that we follow, and you're just surrounded by people that are surrounded by the mission of the institution, which is so unique.
Speaker 2:It comes back to. We are all there to serve the midshipmen and the reality is that we don't have a grad school at the Naval Academy. Right, we have the Naval Postgraduate School, separate institution, also higher level education, but it's not on campus. So that's a very unique thing that provides midshipmen the ability at the undergraduate level to do really cool research, because all of the facilities surrounded, instead of being for the grad students, are for the midshipmen and the resources are just phenomenal. I mean we have wave tanks, we have a wave maker shout out Naval Architecture, ocean Engineering. It's 380 feet long in the basement of Rickover, it's longer than a football field and the ability to just do all these different things and conduct all these different experiments. And midshipmen are the ones working hand in hand with these. You know doctors, doctorate level professors that are publishing work that is recognized on an international level, and it's the midshipmen doing the work instead of the you know, grad students, things like that.
Speaker 2:And the cool thing is that there's so many classes that you're going to take with your whole class, right? That's another very unique thing about the Naval Academy. You're going to be put into a physics class with our maximum class size of 24, usual around 18 students, right? 18 midshipmen is the average class size. You're going to be put in this classroom and you're going to take Calc 1 with a different group of people than you take Calc 2 with, and Calc 3 and physics and chemistry, and everyone's going to take it in your whole class. And it's this bonding experience that you're all learning these technical things, but you're doing it together. And it provides a teamwork aspect where you're not only evolving intellectually and as a leader and loose hall through navigation and leadership classes which are also a very unique thing that you will only get at a service academy type institution but you're doing it together and you're all one team trying to get through this common goal, through this common core of academics.
Speaker 1:And then you also get to branch out into your major. Yeah, absolutely, I love it. Well, sarah, thank you so much for joining us today and sharing your insight on all things classroom experiences at the Naval Academy. You're the best. I genuinely appreciate you taking the time to do this. This is so cool, so kind of you and so yep. Thank you so much. Do you have anything else you want to want to leave Any last?
Speaker 2:parting. Thoughts or things you want to say before we wrap up. Thoughts or things you want to say before we wrap up. I guess my one story of I know you talk about little moments a lot I believe like little things that change the trajectory.
Speaker 2:So my second semester of teaching I had a section, another section of boats, and this first class comes up to me at the end of class and says you're never going to believe this and I never really liked when a midshipman leads off with that but goes you introduced me to the Naval Academy and I was like okay, yeah, like what's like? What do you mean? And in high school, back in 2017, I went on op info back to Cincinnati, ohio, and introduced the Naval Academy to this midshipman. And then, you know, fast forward 2024, six years later, he was sitting right in front of me as a first aid Marine Select getting geared up to go to TBS and about to learn from me for a semester. I just couldn't believe it. You know, I never thought about it. I went on OpInfo so that I could go home early for Thanksgiving right Extra liberty.
Speaker 1:You go on OpInfo yeah right Extra liberty.
Speaker 2:You're trying to get out as much as you can and you propose an ALC. I mean, I took it seriously, I took it very seriously, but I never imagined that six years later, one of those high school kids that I didn't know their names at the time would be sitting in front of me as a first classmanship, and you know, his little brother is there now too. Just one of those small moments I never would have imagined that's so cool.
Speaker 1:I love that. Thank you for for sharing that story and that experience. And again, it's a. It's a, it's a really cool thing and, and to me that's why I'm so grateful people like you are taking the time to come on and shed light and a little bit of insight and a really transparent look at the whole experience, because some, there is a high school kid out there in the world, there is a young man or woman somewhere out there who the Academy would be an incredible place for them and they just don't know about it yet, right, they just don't know about it.
Speaker 1:And so you know, having this opportunity to go out and tell people about the whole experience and highlight all the amazing benefits to get people curious about the academy and like bring them into a place. Then, like you're saying, where the mission is about development, about instilling these people with a sense of service that is embodied by everyone, right, and and there's just a whole added atmosphere, atmosphere and environment of wanting to be of service and wanting to help people and help the development of all the image human going through. So it's so cool. I really appreciate you sharing that anecdote. That's really cool and what a fun like what a fun experience. Right Like that's like one of those real it was crazy.
Speaker 1:Holy smokes, right, holy smokes, so amazing. Well, sarah, thank you so much. I really appreciate you taking the time today.
Speaker 1:And for anyone who's listening. Please feel free to reach out with me Any questions. Sarah is a good friend of mine. So, again, just shoot any questions our way and we'll always do our best to relay them and get things answered for you and get a good insight into the midshipman experience at the Academy. So thank you so much. I hope you enjoyed the episode and have a great day. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of the Academy Insider Podcast. I really hope you liked it, enjoyed it and learned something during this time. If you did, please feel free to like and subscribe or leave a comment about the episode. We really appreciate to hear your feedback about everything and continue to make Academy Insider an amazing service that guides, serves and supports midshipmen, future midshipmen and their families. Thank you.
