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The Academy Insider Podcast - Your Guide to The Naval Academy Experience
The mission of Academy Insider is to guide, serve, and support Midshipmen, future Midshipmen, and their families. Through the perspective of a community of former graduates and Naval Academy insiders, this podcast will help you learn about life at the United States Naval Academy in Annapolis. Through our shared experiences, Academy Insider guides families through the anxiety and frustration caused by lack of understanding, misinformation, and confusion. This platform is designed to better relationships between midshipmen and their loved ones. This podcast is not affiliated with the United States Naval Academy, the United States Navy or Department of Defense. The thoughts and opinions are exclusively those of your host and his guests.
The Academy Insider Podcast - Your Guide to The Naval Academy Experience
#048: Leadership and Resilience: Captain Gervy's Journey as a Surface Warfare Officer
In this episode of the Academy Insider Podcast, Captain Gervy shares his captivating journey from his roots as the son of a Navy Chief to attending the Naval Academy to commanding three different warships. Captain Gervy outlines his path marked by leadership, resilience, and a deep sense of duty. Listen to how his experiences commanding multiple warships and mentoring junior officers (JOs) have shaped his perspective on service and leadership. Plus, get a rare glimpse into the emotional rollercoaster of being a midshipman parent, as he reflects on his daughter's recent graduation from the Academy.
Ever wondered what drives someone to choose the Surface Warfare Officer (SWO) path? Captain Gervy reveals the practical considerations and personal preferences that led him to this career. Through these stories, you'll gain insights into the crucial role of mentorship in overcoming the the initial hurdles of the SWO journey.
Navigating the challenges of a Navy career requires more than just skill; it demands humility, a willingness to learn, and relentless resilience. Captain Gervy emphasizes these qualities as he recounts the rigorous training at the Naval Academy and the real-world challenges faced in the fleet. From managing time and priorities as a young ensign to the emotional journey of seeing his daughter thrive at the Academy, he offers invaluable lessons on leadership and personal growth. This episode is a treasure trove of wisdom for midshipmen, future officers, and their families, underscoring the profound impact of finding purpose within the Navy.
The mission of Academy Insider is to guide, serve, and support Midshipmen, future Midshipmen, and their families.
Grant Vermeer your host is the person who started it all. He is the founder of Academy Insider and the host of The Academy Insider podcast and the USNA Property Network Podcast. He was a recruited athlete which brought him to Annapolis where he was a four year member of the varsity basketball team. He was a cyber operations major and commissioned into the Cryptologic Warfare Community. He was stationed at Fort Meade and supported the Subsurface Direct Support mission.
He separated from the Navy in 2023 and now owns The Vermeer Group, a boutique residential real estate company that specializes in serving the United States Naval Academy community PCSing to California & Texas.
We are here to be your guide through the USNA experience.
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Welcome to Season 2 of the Academy Insider Podcast. Academy Insider is a 501c3 nonprofit organization that serves midshipmen, future midshipmen and their families. At its core, this podcast is designed to bring together a community of Naval Academy graduates and those affiliated with the United States Naval Academy in order to tell stories and provide a little bit of insight into what life at the Naval Academy is really like. I hope you enjoy it. Thank you so much for listening and reach out if you ever have any questions. The Academy Insider Podcast is sponsored by the Vermeer Group, a residential real estate company that serves the United States Naval Academy community and other select clientele in both California and Texas. If I can ever answer a real estate-related question for you or connect you with a trusted Academy-affiliated agent in the market which you're in, please reach out to me directly at grantatthevermeergroupcom. You can also reach out to me on my LinkedIn page, grant Vermeer, and I'd be happy to respond to you there. Thank you so much, and now let's get back to the episode. What's up everyone? Welcome back to the Academy Insider Podcast.
Speaker 1:Today I'm joined by the one and only Captain Jervie. This man is the best. If you don't follow him on Instagram, you have to. I'll put his handle in the show notes. He's a great representative of the Navy, but especially the service warfare community, and so in today's episode we talk all about the SWO life. We talk about his experiences in midshipmen, what brought him into the fleet as a service warfare officer, his taking command of a couple of warships in the Navy and then, specifically from that perspective and from that view, what he sees that causes certain JOs to excel, what causes others to struggle, how he's really focused on teaching, coaching and mentoring young JOs and getting them ready to be leaders and lead in the fleet and enjoy what they're doing and find purpose and mission in the people on the ship. It's an incredible conversation.
Speaker 1:I think you'll get a lot out of it and for all of my parents listening, he's also the parent of a midshipman. Well was, his daughter recently graduated from the Naval Academy and he talks about how being a midshipman parent is actually a lot harder than being a midshipman during his time there at the academy. So I think you'll get a kick out of this episode. If you have any questions about what we talk about, please shoot me a message at any time. Otherwise, I hope you enjoyed the episode. Thank you so much for listening. Have a great day, all right, hey Kevin, thank you so much for taking the time to join us and be a part of the Academy Insider Podcast. If you don't mind just giving the audience they may not know who you are a little bit of background about you what brought you to the Naval Academy and what you're doing now.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. First of all, I just want to thank you, grant, for allowing me to be on your platform. Amazing things that you're doing, spreading the word to the parents, to the loved ones, to the people that have inspirations to go to the Academy. So I appreciate you allowing me to be here. But for who I am, you know. I'll give you the quick 30-second version.
Speaker 2:I am the son of a chief. I am married to the sexiest woman alive 25 years this year, to an academy grad class of 98 plus 1. I'm an academy grad myself. I am a parent to two amazing kids. My daughter graduated from the academy class of 22. I couldn't do the math 98 plus 24. I think that works. And then my son is a sophomore class of 26 at the Merchant Marine Academy. I am a career surface warfare officer. I commanded three ships. I love life. I love my country and I wake up every day with the smile on my face ready to get after life. I love it.
Speaker 2:Why I went to the academy? You know I know you like open and transparent dialogue. I went to the academy for one reason and that was to play football. Right, it was the only opportunity that I had to play division one football. You know I had three goals growing up when I was a kid. It was to go to college without my parents having to pay a single penny. My dad said you will go to college and I ain't paying. So I was like, yes, dad, so that was one of my goals. My second goal was to play football at Notre Dame. My third goal was to be a teacher, a coach, be a positive influence in somebody's life. And by going to the academy I was achieving two of those goals up front and I'll get to the third goal. But that's me in a nutshell.
Speaker 2:I was in three different companies. I was in the seventh company to start off. I got shotgun, went to club 34 back when we had 36 companies, and then we went down to 30. So then I became part of 28. So three different companies. I was oceanography major, played football all four years, captained my senior year, but it all started at NAPS. It all started at NAPS. I was a NAPSer 3-1, and set the foundation for who I am today.
Speaker 1:I love that and again, in the spirit of transparency, this is something I talk about a lot, which is your reason for going to the Naval Academy. Is your reason right? For some people, the best school they got into for you and me it was sports. I'm a recruited basketball player. Like without basketball I'm not going to the Naval Academy, right. But at the same time it doesn't change the fact that I loved it. I embraced the experience and I feel like again, in an honest reflection, I enjoyed and I did a good service as a Naval officer, right.
Speaker 2:And I did a good job and I bought into it Right and my entire career at the Academy playing football my entire career at the Academy playing football I've always felt blessed. I never felt like I belonged there and I was like someone was grabbing me by the coattails and saying come on, jeremy, we're going to go along for this ride. You may not feel like you belong, but there's a special reason why you're here and you're going to make the most of it. Like when I went to NAPS, when I got recruited to play football, I wasn't even the guy that they wanted. Right, there was two legit players at my high school down in San Diego. They wanted one specific guy. He was like 6'3", 205, receiver, could run like a deer he can catch.
Speaker 2:But you know, we kind of had this deal. We would talk because he knew I wanted to go play at Navy. We kind of had this deal. We would talk because he knew I wanted to go play at Navy and he told the recruiter I will go if you bring Jervie along. So I was kind of the package deal. They didn't want me, they wanted LeBron Butts.
Speaker 2:But, fortunate enough for me, they got him and I came along for the ride and again I feel super blessed and that's kind of why I am who I am, because, like, like nothing was ever handed to me. I always knew that I had to work my butt off in order to achieve the things that I wanted to, because nothing was. I wasn't the talent the most talented, I wasn't the most you know, I didn't have the size, the speed, the strength like most D1 athletes or recruits had. I was just the guy that had a lot of heart and I had an opportunity to shine and I made the most of that opportunity.
Speaker 1:Nah, I love that, and and I had an opportunity to shine academy with the sole goal of teaching, coaching and mentoring these young men and women who are getting ready to transition and become, and transform into Navy and Marine Corps officers, right and so Absolutely.
Speaker 2:Like when I first, you know, said that my goal is to be a teacher, a coach. I mean, my vision was in the classroom, my vision was on the field. Little did I know that you could teach, mentor, inspire anybody at any level, whether it's on the ship, on a sub, you know, on the field, and I was able to do that. And you know it's just amazing to me what opportunities the Navy provided me, the things that I wanted to do. You know, you think about the Navy, you think about just kind of sailing to all these wonderful places globally.
Speaker 2:No, it's about the influence and impact that you have on these young lives, teaching them, coaching them and inspiring them along their journey. And that's what made me stay in. I know we'll probably get into it, but I never thought I was going to be in for 27 plus years. I didn't think I'd last more than my commitment of five years. But because I had that opportunity to be a positive influence in young people's lives, I'm still doing it today. Right, I still wake up with a purpose, you know, with fire in my gut, because I have an opportunity to change somebody's life today.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, I love it. I love it and you're right, we are going to jump into it because this episode really is all about being a SWO in the SWO life. And so you're saying you didn't know you were going to stay in for 27 plus years. But what about even one year when you were at the academy Did you know that you wanted to be a SWO? Was there any like summer training that you did? You went on summer cruise and got to go out to sea on a destroyer or some kind of ship that you're like man, I could be a SWO, or kind of. How did you land on actually service selecting to become a service warfare officer?
Speaker 2:Yeah, to be honest with you, I had no idea what I wanted to do. I wanted to play football and that's it Right. But at some point I knew that I had to be a big boy, I had to be mature and I had to start thinking about my future. So, you know, kind of growing up, Top Gun was, you know, a big movie for us. And I wanted to be Maverick. I wanted to fly those freaking sexy F-14s. But I realized that you had to do five years after you earned your wings, that's seven years, man. I wanted to teach, I wanted to coach, I wanted to get out of the service. That was way too long a contract for me so I didn't want to be a pilot.
Speaker 2:During pleb summer we had a Lieutenant Smith who was like this war hero wrote a book. He was a Navy SEAL and this dude was an absolute stud. I was like I want to be like Lieutenant Smith, I want to be a SEAL. But then I realized that they run a lot. They freaking swim in cold water. I was like I don't like the cold water.
Speaker 2:That ain't for me, oh you know. And then I love the Marine uniform. They look sexy as all, super attractive, but again, I don't like to yell. I don't like to be yelled at, so I don't think the Marines would have been a good fit. You know the submarine force as as attractive as that money that nuke pay is like. I love the sun and you know I wanted kids right, so I didn't want to be a nuke.
Speaker 2:So the quickest path for me to achieve the goals that I wanted to achieve, which was to be a teacher, to be a coach, was SWO, because it's five years. You get on a ship, you do your time and then you get out. I didn't realize that you know when you're on your ship and you have your small division, even as a. You know a first, you know ensign, baby ensign on board a ship day one. You are teaching, you are coaching, you are being a positive influence in these young sailors' lives. So you know it. All kinds of shit Like. My purpose of being a SWO was all kinds of jacked up. Right, it was the fastest route out of the NAEP, but it was the one thing that I absolutely loved to do that allowed me to achieve that third goal that I had, you know, since I was little to teach in the coach and I just fell in love with it, right.
Speaker 2:So at what point did I realize it? Maybe you know it was after my plebe year. I did midshipman leadership training. It was kind of like a baby Leatherneck, baby TBS. And I realized, man, like the only two paths for me were either Marine ground or or SWO, because of the timeline and the. You know the, the, the path for me to achieve my goal. And I realized that I didn't want to be a marine like. It was just like, even after plebe year, all year long I was getting yelled at and then I go back I think you know I thought I was done I get a stripe, climbed her and then, and I'm still getting yelled at, I'm like man, this is my fame for me, man. And and I got dirty all the time, I was like I like sleeping in a bed with my Diet Coke and microwave popcorn. So I think the SWO life is for me. So I think it was after my plebe years when I made up my mind that I wanted to be a SWO.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's funny. That was the same realization I had, because I was thinking the same thing. I was like man, maybe I could be a Marine, a Marine ground officer. I think that'd be pretty cool. And then we went out for approach mid and we had to sleep in the field and we're like sleeping in one of those sacks that you put around yourself so bugs don't crawl on you and stuff.
Speaker 2:And I was like no, no, I get itchy grass. I don't like bugs, I don't like spiders or snakes. Hey, that, that, that field life ain't for me. I love to shoot guns. I like to look good in uniform. I think I'd look good with the high and tight. But no, that lifestyle wasn't for me.
Speaker 1:Wasn't for me. Yeah, and then you end up picking Swill. Did they have a ship selection night in your first year? Yeah, is that something. How was that experience for you? What ship did you pick and where did you go first?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So ship selection night was nothing like it is today. I've been to a few of the modern day. You know the drafts, the, you know the big productions. We had nothing like that and you know it was just a small little ceremony. You would line up one by one, you would go into Memorial Hall pick your ship. It wasn't celebrated, you know, it just wasn't a big event.
Speaker 2:Fortunately for me, I didn't have ship selection because I decided to be a graduate assistant right after I graduated. So I stayed on to the for the, on the football staff for six months for the season and because of that I didn't have to choose a ship, which I think I was pretty blessed, because all I wanted was a ship out of San Diego and because my order of merit was so low I was just a dumb jock, you know I probably wouldn't have had a ship available in San Diego. So because I had the opportunity to be a graduate assistant, I was able to pick a ship. You know that wasn't on that list, it was just it was a reserve frigate out of San Diego. But it was the best situation for me because it was a small crew that immediately went on deployment. I was able to get my qualification in nine months. It was an awesome opportunity for me and it just worked out super blessed.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's incredible. And then so you're out there on your first ship, you're qualifying fast, you're doing the slow mission, you're out to sea, you're deploying. Did you have that transition? Did you actually enjoy for lack of a better term the technical and the tactical stuff of being a SWO as well, or were you still just kind of mesmerized and really just being powered on the fact that you were able to have a division, have sailors and be able to make an impact on your life? Like at what point did you were like, oh man, like I actually. I actually do. I love being a SWO, I love what's going on here.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I would say probably the first tour, the first year as an ensign, living that SWO life, was the hardest part of my career ever, like in command as a department head. It didn't get any harder than being a first tour ensign. And the reason why it was so hard is because, first of all, I didn't know what to expect right. I had to learn my equipment, I had to learn my people, I had to learn how to be a SWO and I didn't have time for it all right, I was just trying to figure out, you know, which way was the bow, which way was the stern, how'd I get to my rack? Like it was hard. It took me like at least two, three months to figure out the ship and I was supposed to learn how to drive this thing and be proficient and be tactical. So it was a very daunting experience upfront, right. And then I started to realize my mission first, first and foremost, is to learn my people right. And once I can take care of my people and understand what they need in order for them to be successful, then I'm it kind of got easier for me, because once I figured out that as long as I take care of my people, then my people will give me every opportunity to work on my qualifications and as a non-qualified service warfare officer, you really just need time to work on your quals. And when the people and the job was so good and the routine was just established where they allowed me the time to just work on myself, then it got a little bit easier.
Speaker 2:It didn't hurt that we went on mission off the bat and I was like the go-to conning officer.
Speaker 2:When I went through the Panama Canal all the sea and anchor details I was the conning officer. So I really learned how to drive a ship on a frigate and you know you could pull in a port without the use of tugs. So your ship handling skills had to be on point. So I figured that out right away and I use a lot of my athletic you know, just hand-eye coordination and feel for, you know, the ship to help me drive that ship. And once the captain realized I was pretty damn good at driving the ship, then he gave me a lot of more. You know, he gave me a lot. He trusted me a lot more, gave me a lot more leeway and uh, you know, that's why I was able to qualify so fast, because they were able to see that I got it right away, that I you know, that I was able, you know, to control the ship and run the deck kind of simultaneously, and they trusted me so much that they allowed me to kind of progress through my quals.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and did you have any mentors in that fleet, that first tour, and saying, like, do you have any other? Even if it was the JO department head, your chief, whatever it was, do you have any mentors that you remember specifically from that time that helped you make those realizations, that helped you get to that point, that helped you qualify? Um, like, who are the people that made an impact in your life on?
Speaker 2:USS first ship. So you know I, when I was at the Academy there were no swos that I looked up to right. I remember the folks that taught me pro dev and they were all like swos that were getting out of the Navy, that they were just there to. You know, it was their sunset tour. And that's why it kind of turned me off about the SWO community because in my opinion, like the best and the brightest were like the Marines, the SEALs, you know the aviators that were wearing that uniform and showing the best of their service, and I didn't feel like we had that in the SWO community. So I kind of went into my SWO job a little bit jaded.
Speaker 2:But when I first showed up it was my senior chief, stgc Adolphson, that took me under his wing. You know that. You know that I got in trouble or anytime. I had a route of cash rep.
Speaker 2:That senior chief was in my hip pocket and he showed me the ways of a, how to take care of your people, how to lead, how to be proficient, how to, you know, earn some trust and credibility with the people.
Speaker 2:And for him in his mind, you know, his success is going to be determined by how well, I do right If I'm a complete dirtbag, that's a direct reflection on him. So he had a vested interest in my progression, my development. So I am who I am today because of Senior Chief Adolphson and the way that he took me under his wing and he ensured that I succeeded on that first tour. You know there was no my department head, it wasn't my XO or CO. It was that Chief Adolphson who took me under his wing, who ensured that I succeeded, that I looked good in uniform, that I was present where I needed to be, when I needed to be there, that I sounded good, that I was well prepared. He was the one that put me on a pedestal to make me shine, because he knew that if I shine, then the entire division was winning.
Speaker 1:He was winning and we all looked good together. Nah, that's a fact and the relationship between a chief or a senior chief kind of the senior enlisted leader in your department or your division and a junior officer is one of the most special relationships any junior officer is going to have in their time in the Navy, right, and I stand by that Absolutely. For anyone who's listening, I encourage you to go and check out an episode I recorded with Command Master Chief Jeff Kirby. We talked all about this. So, if you're not fully understanding kind of the relationship between a senior enlisted individual and a junior officer, because it's interesting. Usually, again, this senior chief is probably what? 40, 42, 43 years old and you're a 22-year-old ensign, right he's old enough to be my father.
Speaker 1:He's old enough to be yourign, right. He's old enough to be my father. He's old enough to be your father, right, like that's it. And so this relationship, it's something that's so powerful, so unique to the military service, that if you don't fully understand or comprehend that, I encourage you to check out that episode, because it'll only make that story that much more special, right, the relationship? And I think I was yeah, yeah, yeah, go.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I'm sorry, but I was pretty fortunate because my dad was a chief right and he was the one that told me you want to be successful, you lean on that chief right and then so every command I've had, the first group of folks that I always talked to was the mess right. They're the ones that had to buy in. Once the chief mess bought in, then I couldn't lose right. And I would tell the chiefs if we win as a ship, it's because of you, if we lose as a ship, it's because of you. So you guys are the ones that determine whether or not we win or we lose Right.
Speaker 2:And it was the relationship that I shared with my CMC. We were so tight, we were in lockstep. We didn't always disagree or we didn't always agree, but when we did disagree, like, he was always the first one to tell me right. As you can imagine, I'm a pretty wild CEO and I could probably I have some pretty wild ideas that are pretty risque, right. But my command mass chief would always say you know, sir, I love you to death and I know you're a wild cowboy, but this may be a little too wild. So he saved my butt plenty of occasions, right and if it wasn't for that, you know that CMC or that mess, you know to kind of tell you, sir, you know you are wrong or you need to do this that, like as leaders, we need to be humble enough to realize that we are not the end. All be all Like we got to make a decision at the end of the day.
Speaker 1:But listen, there are smarter people that have more experience that can help, guide you and advise you so that you make the right decisions, so your butt doesn't get fired yeah, no 100 100 so yeah, if you take anything out of this episode the navy runs on the back of the navy chief man and, like you're saying, I agree 100 the, the, the success of the ship, whether you win or lose, the success of the navy, whatever, like it runs on the chief's mess. The chief's mess is one of the most special things in the whole world and they're powerful. They're powerful.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I tell everybody all the time, regardless, like I may be the commanding officer, the captain of the ship, you would think I'd have access to every single space on board the ship. I do, with the exception of one and that's the chief's mast. I still knock and I still request permission to come aboard because that place is special, special.
Speaker 1:And so kind of moving on. Now you talk about the fact, hey, I'm trying to get out in five, right. But then you start to realize you like it, you're progressing in your career and you end up taking commands of a warship. What was that feeling like? Are you able to articulate kind of the feeling and emotion associated with commanding a warship? And how was it for your dad being a Navy chief watching his son take command of a ship? Can you kind of talk about that experience of taking command and what it?
Speaker 2:meant to you and what it meant to your family. Yeah, I never thought that I'd have the opportunity to command a ship, right, I thought that I was just going to be a divo. I was going to be a department head, I was going to get out of the Navy and that was going to be it for me. But as soon as I started realizing that I have an impact in these young people's lives and I'm loving what I'm doing and at the command level, it's only going to get bigger I'm just going to have more responsibility with more people to positively impact I was like man, this is something that I'm absolutely thrilled and excited and pumped to be able to do. You know people always talk about the burden of command. You know they have all of this responsibility that rests solely on their shoulders. I don't look at it as a burden. I look at it as an opportunity to be a role model, to be an inspiration, a mentor to so many people 400, 450 people to see them grow, to see them thrive, to see them win. So, when you think about the emotions of taking command, I've gotten better with the three commands that I've had a part of.
Speaker 2:But one thing I realized that it's not about the mission. The mission will take care of itself. As long as you take care of the people, right, as a CEO, you have a direct impact in your sailors' lives. Once you take care of the people, guess what? They are going to work their butts off to ensure that you don't lose. And when you have 400 sailors that are working their butts off for one common goal, the ship can't lose. Guaranteed to meet mission, to sail on time, you know, to get the rounds down range on target every single time, because your people will make it happen. These sailors are smart, they're trained well, they want to win. They just want the opportunity and they want leadership to trust in them, to celebrate their wins and appreciate and give them pats on the backs, you know, and tell them that they love them, because when they feel that way, when they feel valued, they're going to do anything for you.
Speaker 1:Anything, anything right, and I think that's it's a special sentiment and I kind of want to pick your brain on the perspective of this. So you're talking about, you have the opportunity to inspire, you have the opportunity to teach. You have the opportunity to inspire, you have the opportunity to teach, you have the opportunity to coach. Right and for the parents who may be listening, whose son or daughter may be a SWO or may be getting ready to become a SWO, when you saw young JOs report to your ship when you're in command, what did you see that caused some of them to excel and some of them to struggle, and then kind of in your vein, and what you wanted to do. How did you address that and try and proactively mentor some of these young ensigns and JGs and what was your approach to teaching, coaching and mentoring junior officers checking into their ship for the first time?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think there's two things I address because I've seen it all the time, even when I was a young JO. There's two specific things that I've seen and witnessed that can make or break a young ensign when they first report on board a ship. First is humility. Right, when you get some of these ensigns that come straight from the academy, thinking that they're all that wearing their ring and they got this bright, shiny gold bar on their shoulders and they think that they're in charge, the boss even they outrank the chief so they could tell them what to do, you're not going to do well, right. But when you come in with a humble attitude, thinking, man, I got a lot to learn. I know I'm going to make mistakes, I know that I don't know everything, but I'm sure going to learn and I'm going to ask for help. I'm going to ask the young seaman, I'm going to ask the second class petty officers in charge, I'm going to ask the chief what do I need to do to be successful? When ensigns come on board and they have that sort of mentality, they're going to do well.
Speaker 2:And I tell ensigns all the time, your job as a first tour ensign is to learn, is to make mistakes, go around, ask questions, be vulnerable right. If you think that when you go and stand a bridge, watch if you make a mistake, that's the end of your career, you're wrong. That's your job. The officer at deck is going to make sure that you steer the ship in the right direction. But if you're not being bold and not being proactive in making the commands and driving the ship, then you're wrong. Like, get out of the corner, be upfront, be bold, make decisions and if it's wrong, oh well, learn from it. Right.
Speaker 2:And the second thing is you got to learn how to deal with adversity as a young ensign going through the process. It's tough. You're going to make mistakes. You're not always going to win, but if you're going to crumble and feel sorry for yourself and you know not, pick yourself up, dust yourself off. Listen, it's a tough job. That's what Plebe Summer is for. Right, because Plebe Summer is designed for you to fail right, so that they can see how you're going to get yourself back up, dust yourself off and move on, as long as you don't make that same mistake over and over and over again. So you come in with a humble attitude, humble mentality and understand that you're going to make mistakes and how you deal with that adversity, how you deal with those setbacks, is going to determine whether or not you're going to be a career swill. You're going to be a commander of a ship at sea or you're going to get out and do something else work at McDonald's, right.
Speaker 1:So it's really the choice, is really up to you to determine whether or not you're going to be successful in this organization 100% and, like you mentioned, this is the relation to the academy here, and the academy experience is something I talk about all the time, which is that the academy is hard and it's meant to be hard, because once you graduate and you go to the fleet, it's going to be harder, right. And so if you, if you take an approach to the academy of like, oh, I just hope things will get easier, then you won't Like that's not how, that's not how it works. And I think that's what makes the Service Academy so special is we have those senior enlisted leaders, the senior mentors, who are able to guide you and make you realize this that the purpose of Plebe Summer is just to get better dealing with hard situations.
Speaker 2:We're not waiting to get easier.
Speaker 1:It's not going to get easier. We just get better dealing with hard things so that way you can go out and do the next harder thing and be ready to learn and grow from that and then be ready to approach the thing that's going to be even harder after that. Right, the academy is hard. What's crazy yeah.
Speaker 2:Go yeah. So what's crazy is you don't realize that while you're at the academy, right, you think about it and you think about life as a plebe and you think, man, this sucks, I can't do this for four years. I can't live this lifestyle. But you know what? You're only a plebe once when you're a SWO, you're only an unqualified SWO once. That's not how your life is going to be.
Speaker 2:Once you figure things out and you learn how to be a SWO, then guess what? You may get more responsibilities, but you're also going to have more authority, right, you're also going to have more opportunities to impact change. And then, when you're a firstie, guess what? You're running the friggin show. You're brigade commander, regimental commander, like you are in charge. So that amount of suck is a short period, right, and that's all by design and that's how it is in the fleet. So and I didn't realize that I didn't realize that you know, the regiment is purposefully done and orchestrated so that you will succeed out in the fleet.
Speaker 2:Because you know what? After you graduate, you become a plebe again, whether you like it or not. You're going to get beat down, beat down, but you're going to get qualified and you're going to learn and you're going to grow. Then you're going to have smaller responsibility, then bigger responsibility, then guess what? You're going to be in charge, and once folks understand that, then they're going to thrive at the Naval Academy, right? Because they think life as a plebe is how it's going to be all four years. It's not, that's just a period of indoctrination. It's going to help you learn how to manage your time, how to handle adversity, how to deal with superiors. So then when you become an upper class, now you kind of figure things out. Now you're responsible for training the young police, and then it becomes cyclical.
Speaker 1:Cyclical. That's right. And again, that's one of the beautiful things. This is what, I think, makes the Service Academy so special, right Is it instills in you, whether you realize it or not, it instills in you a certain level of toughness and a certain level of resiliency. Right, you get used to doing hard things.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 1:Working hard and fighting through difficulty, fighting through adversity, sailing through that storm.
Speaker 2:That is a muscle that you have to work out, that is something that you build, it's something you get used to and believe it or not, you are experiencing that, like whether or not you like it or not, like you are building those muscle sets, you know, or the muscle memory as you're going through the process. When I was a senior, graduating, I wanted nothing to do with the academy, like I put in all my stuff in a bag and I toss it out in the garbage. You know, after I graduated I graduated, but then I look back and I'm like man, that's why I learned all that stuff, all that table salt, all that stuff from the reef points, all that pro knowledge stuff it's so that I can become a better officer in the Navy and then I started to appreciate the academy. Maybe even five years after I graduated is when I really started to appreciate everything that I learned.
Speaker 2:And then I would think back and I think, man, when I went to NAPS, this is why I went and did all of these hard things when I was a plebe, this is why I learned all of these things. So they got me prepared for this moment and it didn't click until like five years after the academy and that's when I really started to appreciate and value and love the Academy that much more. I could tell you, probably about 95% of midshipmen don't love the Academy while they're there, but when they see the experiences and how it molded them to become the officer that they are, man, I love it twofold now and I am so proud to be from that institution that I would never take back anything I would never. You know. If there's no regrets that I've had like, yeah, I may have sucked, it may have been hard, but I have no regrets because it made me the officer that I am today and I'm so thankful and blessed.
Speaker 1:Blessed. Best decision we ever made in our lives. We didn't realize it, we just wanted to play a sport. Well, yeah, decision we ever made in our lives. We didn't realize, well, we just wanted to play a sport.
Speaker 2:Well yeah, get it. What are you gonna say? So it was the second most important decision I made in my life. Yeah, my first, most important, was deciding who I was gonna be the rest, yeah, I'll spend the rest of my life with. That's my number one right, it'll shift.
Speaker 1:The second most was for me too. You're a good man.
Speaker 2:I appreciate you. We're on the same page, brother.
Speaker 1:Oh man, but yeah, just again in the theme of of the fact that it's that it's hard, right, and the fact that it's hard and being out and being an unqualified SWO, life is difficult. What did you see as the most difficult challenges in the day-to-day life of a young SWO? Right, like going is it? Is it staying in the watch? Is it qualifying? Like what things make life really difficult as a young SWO, unqualified, checking into their ship for the first time?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think the most difficult part of being an unqualified ensign is just managing your time understanding what's important and using your time to understanding what's important and using your time to do what's your priority. And if you have a not so good commanding officer and they tell you everything is your priority, you're going to get smoked, right. You're going to be overwhelmed, you're going to feel like there's you can't do anything, you're a loser, you can't win, and it's going to be a really tough experience for you, right? But when you have someone that can outline what your priorities are, I want you to spend your time doing this. I want you to have 25% of your quals done by this amount of time. Now you have something that you can measure. Now you have something where you can kind of manage and say, all right, if he wants me to be 25% done with my quads by this certain time, well, I can spend two hours of my day doing this and if I do that every day I'll be at that 25%. But it's hard when you don't know how to manage your time and you think your people, your equipment, your maintenance, you know your qualifications, you know your ability to drive a ship are all at the same level, and if you don't have anyone to mentor you and to help you and guide you and they just say do all of it which I've seen in the past you're going to smoke out these young ensigns and they're going to feel defeated and they're going to walk away with the head in between their legs, feeling like there's nothing that they can accomplish.
Speaker 2:So my advice to these young ensigns is go to your ship, figure out what your captain's priorities are for you, and I'm going to tell you your priority should be to learn. You know to make mistakes, to ask a lot of questions. Develop a relationship with your chief and tell them chief, I got your back. If you want me to be you know, the devo, you know and you know responsible for all of these decisions with the people and the equipment, tell me that. Or if you want me to get my qualifications so I could be the devo that you need me to be, tell me that. Right, hopefully, your chief will tell you chief, we got the division.
Speaker 2:Just show up for quarters, you know. Provide your guidance, look good in uniform, be on time and then go out and do your thing. Get your qual, be the best dang ship driver, be the best dang CIC watch officer, be the best dang OD and SWO that you could possibly be. When you have people that can set those guidelines for you and figure out and draw that path for you, guarantee you're going to be a much better plebe, a much better ensign, a much better SWO. Right, you got to see the forest from the trees. You got to understand what the big vision, the big goals. You got to understand your why, because if you don't, you're just going to get caught up in the minutia and all the BS that you're dealing with and then you won't see the fruits of all of your labor. Understand that it's going to be a grind, but if you stay positive, understand that there's something bigger, something better, something more beautiful out there. I just got to suck it up for a little bit until I get my qual.
Speaker 1:You're not going to win unless you have that attitude 100% In kind of embracing that big picture mindset and understanding the why and seeing the high level. What do you do as a captain to really help people see that right? And what did you do to help instill the sense of mission, purpose and literal fulfillment to young JOs? Like, how did you relay the overall mission of the ship and can you explain to and again, I know it'd be different based on class of ship and whatnot, but can you give a brief rundown on like hey, what is the mission of the ship and how do we instill that sense of purpose and pride and fulfillment to young JOs?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so, first off, when I have young JOs, I always talk to the non-qual separately and I talk about all things other than the mission. I talk leadership. I talk about character and trust and things that we value in the Navy organization as leaders. Right, what your mindset should be when you go to the next level and we have these discussions and we talk nothing but leadership, right, and then we kind of end with all right, how are you doing with your quals? You know, what percentage are you at? What are you struggling with? Who is helping you, who is not helping you, who are the barriers? And we address it at that level and as transparent as a you know commanding officer, as I am. Man, they lay the dirt and I want them to. Right, because I want everyone to know that these folks feel comfortable in telling me who are the barriers, who is standing in their way from achieving their quals? Right, because they know that I'm going to take it to the next level and say, hey, why are you having this conversation? Or why are you standing in the way of this person and clipping their wings? So you know how do I guide these young ensigns or non-quals.
Speaker 2:I have a weekly conversation with them right and I want to see how they're doing. How is their mental state right? Are they feeling like they're thriving? Are they feeling like they're struggling? How can I help them?
Speaker 2:First questions that I ask these young jails is who are you? What do you want out of life? How can I help you achieve it? Right, because, as whatever, that's my responsibility to help them get there. Yeah, I'm going to, you know, I'm going to try to convey to them there's nothing sexier than being a SWO and help them stay in our community. But if they are dead set, if their goal in life is to do something else, it's my responsibility to help them achieve it right.
Speaker 2:What kind of leader would I be if I denied it? Because I am selfish and I just want them to remain a SWO. So we talk about life, we talk about love, we talk about leadership and once they feel like the boss cares about them, cares about their progression, man, they're going to work their butts off to ensure that they maintain that track. Maintain, you know, that track. They maintain that level. Where you know, I told the captain that I was going to be qualified, based on our schedule, in 18 months. I am tracking or I'm going to beat it by two months and I'm going to celebrate with the captain and show him that I'm two months early. We have those conversations on a weekly basis, you know, and if other ships, other commands aren't doing that, hopefully the SWO is doing that, the senior watch officer is doing that, the department heads are doing that, but that should be a conversation that all leaders should have with their subordinates, because your main job as a leader is to understand what your people want and give them every opportunity to achieve it.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, I love it. I love it and I want to take a quick pause as a vocabulary terminology explanation session on some of the amazing things that you just said. Again, for someone who's listening may have no idea what you said there are a couple of terms that I want you to know.
Speaker 1:This is great. This is why I love this platform. Right, it gives us an opportunity to talk about all these amazing things, but also break things down for people too, right yeah, so you mentioned two specific ship terms CIC and OOD. You mind just giving a quick, a really brief, quick explanation of you know, a breakout of the terms and what they are?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so you talked about the tactical level of fighting on a warship. We do that out of CIC and that's the Combat Information Center, and part of your qualification in becoming a surface warfare officer is becoming a CIC Combat Information Center watch officer, where you learn how to work the radars, you learn how to work the weapon systems and you provide the tactical situation to the officer of the deck, that's the OOD, the ones that's in charge of running the ship. You know the driving of the ship, the overall, you know just the overall status of the ship.
Speaker 2:Whether it is an engineering plant, whether it's your weapon systems, your comms, and you know.
Speaker 2:So again, there are certain steps.
Speaker 2:You have to be a fighter fighter, you know. You have to be a medical provider. You have to learn how to fight the ship, you know. You have to learn how to defend the ship. You have to learn how to drive the ship, all before you're one board with the commanding officer to get your surface warfare officer pin. That's why it's so difficult, because there's so many things that are asked of you, so many things that are expected out of you. Before you get that warfare pin on your chest, you have to have an understanding of how the entire ship works, and not just your ship right, but all the other ships in the Navy right between all of you know, the cruisers, destroyers, the amphibs, the carriers, the LCS, the minesweeps, the submarines. You have to have a working knowledge, all of the ships with the weapon systems on all the ships, the capabilities and limitations of all those ships, systems on all the ships, the capabilities and limitations of all those ships, before you have that conversation with the commanding officer to determine whether or not you're worthy of wearing the pin.
Speaker 1:Yeah, amazing. And you mentioned earlier in the episode you have a daughter. She's an academy grad. She following your footsteps, does she go slow? And then, with that is, what was your advice to her specifically as she started her journey as a young, unqualified ensign?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So there's nothing that makes me more prouder than to have a daughter that graduated from the same institution. I did, same institution mom did, and then chose the same service as mom and dad. So she became a SWO. She is the deck devo on the USS San Diego right now, thriving, doing great things. Absolutely love her to death, you know, and I had to.
Speaker 2:I had to treat her differently than my junior officers, right, cause she's heard me give all this advice to all the JOs and I didn't want to be. It's confusing to me which hat I wear. Do I wear dad hat? Do I wear slow daddy hat? Which one do I wear? So I'm just, you know, as a dad. I just tell her to smile, enjoy the ride, have fun. You know, take care of your people is the most important thing. And then I leave it up to her people to help her with her qualifications. I just want to see her happy. I want to see her feeling safe and comfortable on the ship. I want to see her thrive. I don't want to see her going home like smoked and burnt and feeling just hopeless, right?
Speaker 2:So it is my job just to provide the motivation and say babe, how are you doing today? Are you thriving? Are you smiling on your face? You know, what wins did you have? I don't get into technical terms, I don't get into, you know, any of the deep conversations with her qual process. I just say are you winning today? What did you do for your Navy day? You take care of your people. How's your chief?
Speaker 2:Those are the conversations I have with her, cause you know she doesn't want dad in her knickers. You know, if there's a problem and I say you want me to talk to you. Seriously, dad, I got this, you know. And yeah, and you know that's that's a hard position to put me in, because I want to fix right. I want to be there to make it easier for her. But what? What am I doing to her? I'm just enabling, you know just. You know just that that sort of behavior that's not going to be helpful for her in her long-term career. So I want her to figure things on her own and, um, she's doing a heck of a job and I'm super proud of her.
Speaker 1:I love that. Having been an academy grad yourself and now the parent of an academy midshipman, what do you? What do you think was hard? What was your experience as an academy parent? What was it, uh, in your mind?
Speaker 2:yeah. So I thought being a mid was hard. I thought it was tough, but there is nothing like being a parent to a midshipman because as a mid, there are certain things you can control. You control most of your time and, at the academy, the choices you make. You got to own them. You take full accountability for them, but there's no choices that you can make as a parent. You don't even know what's going on with your kid. Like, I believe, Summer.
Speaker 2:I think I talked to her twice, you know during, you know, the cell phone conversation on a Sunday for five minutes and most of it was spent crying and babbling because I couldn't have a conversation. I miss my daughter so much. It was so hard being a conversation. I miss my daughter so much it was so hard being a parent. Seeing her leave my arms, seeing her enter Alumni Hall on I-Day, was probably the most difficult time for me in my life. Like you talk about, you know, your life on a ship as an unqual. You know you talk about being a plebe during plebe summer.
Speaker 2:That was all easy for me compared to letting my daughter go, seeing her walk away entering alumni hall, and I was just like man, how am I going to? How am I going to do this? And then I saw her after she gave the oath and then she was smiling and she was like, uh, I'm going to be okay, dad, Don't worry. Then I breathed and I was like, okay, she's going to be okay. Got the first phone call, cried my butt off and she said she's going to be okay, I was fine. Went there for parents weekend, you know, her hair grew a little bit longer. She's smiling, you know. Again I was like, okay, she's going to be okay. And then it got a little bit easier as a parent and with the culminating event being graduation, you know it. Just, the four years were tense as a parent, but you know, the joy of seeing her graduate, throwing her cover in the air, was much more rewarding and enjoyable than it was for me as a midshipman.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I love it All right. Well, I appreciate that we're going to start to wrap up, but I want to give you the opportunity to make your best recruiting pitch for anyone listening about why they should be a SWO. What makes being a SWO special? What makes being a SWO awesome for any high school kid who may be considering the academy? What makes being a SWO special? What makes being a SWO awesome for any high school kid who may be considering the academy Like why should they consider an academy or an ROTC program and consider a career in the Navy and why, specifically, a SWO?
Speaker 2:So my pitch is there's nothing sexier than driving a ship and leading people In the service. That's what we are called to do. The Navy organization is about ships. It's about people and as a SWO, you get the opportunity to drive them from the West Coast to Europe, from the West Coast to South China Sea, through the Panama Canal, to the East Coast to the Mediterranean. You have the opportunity to sail this gigantic national treasure all over the world. One person driving the ship and that's you as a SWO, and you get the opportunity to lead the finest sailors this Navy has to offer. So when you get, you know you could probably fly a plane. That's cool, but you're not leading people. You know you can, you know, be on the ground, shooting rifles, whatever, but you're not leading people.
Speaker 2:Being a SWO means being proficient in handling the ship, all the maintenance that is on board the ship, with all the machines and machinery and equipment, and actually driving a ship from point A to point B, firing the weapon systems. That's all great and there is nothing like it. But the opportunity to take care of people from the very beginning, from day one, the first day you step on board the ship, seeing them grow, mature, thrive on board that ship and then you having a direct impact in their lives. There's no greater joy. And then, when you are the captain of your ship and seeing everybody thriving, everybody smiling, everybody walking away with a positive sea story because of you, it doesn't get any better, right. And the only opportunity you have to do that is be captain of a ship. And it all starts with being a surface warfare officer.
Speaker 1:I love it. I love it.
Speaker 2:You heard the man, you heard the man you heard, the captain, baby you heard the captain, captain out, captain out, let's go.
Speaker 1:Now just one final question. You know you had mentioned your senior chief. You know playing such a huge role in your development. You mentioned that there weren't any SWOs specifically that were mentors to you at the academy, but do you have anyone who made a really positive impact on your Naval Academy experience, whether it be a coach, a company officer, someone on the yard? I want to give you this opportunity just to say give a shout out to someone and talk about someone who made a really positive impact on your experiences in midshipmen.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I think that this is one program that's very special about the service academy, specifically the Naval Academy. The one person or persons that made a huge impact in my time at the Academy was my sponsor family. Believe it or not, my sponsor family made me feel like I was at home, right, I'm from a Filipino background. We love our culture, our food. We love just being surrounded by family. They were my family away from home. So every weekend when I felt homesick, when I felt super far away from my mom and my dad, my brother, my sister, I would go to my time at the academy had it not been for my sponsor family at the Naval Academy.
Speaker 2:And the second person is probably weird to say, but my wife. Like, I met her at the Naval Academy. She was my best friend for two years. We did everything together. She was a cheerleader.
Speaker 2:I remember at the end of games I was just super tired. While everyone went out partying, I just went back to our sponsor's house and we would just go hang out and we would talk story and I was able to kind of just relax and feel, you know, just recharge my battery and feel at home, being next to her and having her. As you know, that person that talked me through you know kind of tough times. If I had a bad game, if we had suffered a loss, she would tell me we'd be okay. You know wake up the next day for another opportunity to get after it. She's been there for me through my entire academy life, through my entire naval career. So you know, when you talk about someone who's had a major impact in my life through the Naval Academy, it's been that, you know midshipman, you know first class Bernice, javier, now Elota who's helped guide me, mentor me, who challenged me, who's loved me every single step of the way.
Speaker 1:I love it. Well, kev, thank you so much for taking this time to join us today. Talk through again your perspective from commanding warships, talking about the JO experience and getting to share some amazing stories, amazing sea stories and just general insight into the Naval Academy experience. I really appreciate you taking the time to do this uh, taking a break from your schedule running around all the fleet weeks across the country.
Speaker 2:Well, I appreciate you, grant and uh, and I appreciate what you're doing. I appreciate your platform in giving this, telling the story from different perspectives. You know and I've seen you know, all of your episodes. You know when you talk about NAPS, when you talk about the aviation community you talk about, you know, the senior enlisted community and how it all kind of ties together from you know, a high school kid that knows nothing about the academy, from a parent who knows nothing what their child is about to experience to what is potentially going to be, you know, their career choice, going to be their lifestyle. And hopefully, you know something that they'd be proud of, something that they're going to look back and say, man, if it wasn't for Grant and his podcast, I wouldn't have been prepared for this experience. So I'm glad I listened to it so I could better prepare myself for what my kid or myself is going to endure, you know, for the next four years, the next 27 plus years, just like me.
Speaker 1:You're the man. I appreciate it. Thank you Genuinely. Thank you, I really appreciate you, grant, all right, everyone listening. I hope you enjoyed the episode. Feel free to reach out with any questions. Otherwise, have a good day, peace. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of the Academy Insider Podcast. I really hope you liked it, enjoyed it and learned something during this time. If you did, please feel free to like and subscribe or leave a comment about the episode. We really appreciate to hear your feedback about everything and continue to make Academy Insider an amazing service that guides, serves and supports midshipmen, future midshipmen and their families. Thank you.
